Arwen and Mortality Question

External Since: Feb 27, 2004 Posts: 15

Hey Guys, Can you help me with this one.

2 questions:

1) What is the nature of her choice and why is it that she has this doom
laid upon her?
Is it because like Elrond, she has human lineage and therefor has to make
the same choice about mortality/imortality that her father had to do?
Or is it simply a clause imposed directly on her by the Valar because she
had fallen in love with a mortal?

2) I was wondering how long Arwen could *technically * live for once she had
made the choice of becoming mortal. I was thinking about Elros and his
choice to become mortal, he lived for 500 years but eventially felt old age
creep up on him.

possibility 1) If Arwen is now a 'mortal' in the 'Tolkien sense' only, in
that she is no longer bound to the world, her body would still immortal in
the sense that it wont grow old and die, so she might technically be able to
live forever, in the sense that she wouldnt physically grow old. (although
of course she lost her will to live once aragorn died, but this is
different).

Possibility 2) She is mortal in the Tolkien sense but also in the same way
as Elros, and she now also has the *body* of a mortal, however, because of
her elven blood, she might still expect a long life, perhaps similar to
Elros's 500 years (Again, lack of will to live would still be a decider, but
say she did want to linger, perhaps she might live for a few centuries more
if she had wished it?)

Then comes the thing about Arwen's brothers but I gather no-one really
know's what the hells going on there

Regards,
Douglas

--
-----------------------------------------------
'Drive away and try to keep smiling. Get a little rock and roll on the radio
and go toward all the life there is with all the courage you can find and
all the belief you can muster. Be true, be brave, stand. All the rest is
darkness.'
Stephen King's IT

External Since: Feb 01, 2004 Posts: 323

"Douglas Eckhart" <douglas.eckhart.TakeThisOut@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:bqqd5v$hme$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> Hey Guys, Can you help me with this one.
>
> 2 questions:
>
> 1) What is the nature of her choice and why is it that she has this
doom
> laid upon her?

All the Half-elven, or Peredhril have the choice of their fate: to
either be immortal as the Elves (such as Elrond chose) or mortal as Men
(as Elros chose). The children of those who choose immortality, ie,
decline the Gift of Illuvatar, have the option of accepting the Gift
(mortality). The children of those that choose mortality do not have a
choice -- they are mortal too.

Arwen, being the child of a Peredhril that chose immortality, has a
choice.

> Is it because like Elrond, she has human lineage and therefor has to
make
> the same choice about mortality/imortality that her father had to do?

Yes.

> Or is it simply a clause imposed directly on her by the Valar because
she
> had fallen in love with a mortal?

It isn't so much that she fell in love as in choosing to live the life
of a mortal to marry Aragorn. She could have denied her love and
followed Elrond into the West.

>
>
> 2) I was wondering how long Arwen could *technically * live for once
she had
> made the choice of becoming mortal. I was thinking about Elros and his
> choice to become mortal, he lived for 500 years but eventially felt
old age
> creep up on him.

At the time of the War of the Ring, she was already 2,776 years old.
Whether she would start aging as a mortal at the time of her choice is
not clear, though I think it likely. I would assume that she would have
had the long life similar to that of the Numenoreans. She died, at least
in part due to her grief over Aragorn's death, about 120 years after her
choice, or at around 2,896 years of age. Still, 120 years would be short
for a Numenorean.

>
> possibility 1) If Arwen is now a 'mortal' in the 'Tolkien sense' only,
in
> that she is no longer bound to the world, her body would still
immortal in
> the sense that it wont grow old and die, so she might technically be
able to
> live forever, in the sense that she wouldnt physically grow old.
(although
> of course she lost her will to live once aragorn died, but this is
> different).
>
> Possibility 2) She is mortal in the Tolkien sense but also in the same
way
> as Elros, and she now also has the *body* of a mortal, however,
because of
> her elven blood, she might still expect a long life, perhaps similar
to
> Elros's 500 years (Again, lack of will to live would still be a
decider, but
> say she did want to linger, perhaps she might live for a few centuries
more
> if she had wished it?)

I would say she became a mortal, body and soul.

>
>
> Then comes the thing about Arwen's brothers but I gather no-one really
> know's what the hells going on there

I believe they chose immortality.
--
Bill

"Wise fool"
Gandalf, THE TWO TOWERS
-- The Wise will remove 'se' to reply; the Foolish will not--