Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach?

Justin Samuels wrote:
 > I was thinking, there's almost no way in hell Cyclops should be
 > allowed to lead the X-Men.
 >
 > The CEO of Boeing was recently fired from running the company in part
 > due to an inappropriate affair he had with a female executive.

I'd need to know a lot more details about that before accepting it as a
comparison, what was "inappropriate" about it?

 > Cyclops had an inappropriate affair with the White Queen, and then
 > shacks up with her right after Phoenix's death.

Again, define inappropriate. His wife was going cosmically inhuman on them,
had made a pass at Wolverine, and they hadn't been together properly since
before "The Search for Cyclops".

 > And we're supposed to believe not only do the X-Men except an insane
 > Cyclops

Why insane?

 > (along with a devious White Queen)

Deviousness is not a crime

 >leading them, but that the parents of the children are all okay with it?
 >
 > Yes, right.

Emma Frost may have her problems, but she is a qualified teacher, a former
headmistress of one of the USA's most prestigious private schools, and CEO
of Frost Industries.

 > The cuckoos have often commented on what a poor example the White
 > Queen is

Yeah, sure take the word of a group of pubescent telepaths with almost no
real life experience.

 > and how she is a danger to impressionable young students.
 > The cuckoos blamed her for the death's of Esme and Sophie.

Again, they were hardly what you'd call unbiased there. And IIRC they
accused her of inspiring Sophie to be heroic.

 > so then why is such a woman allowed to lead the X-Men?

Because she has A) Shown remorse B) Proved her worth as a team-mate, C) Is
an experienced administrator (Which is a lot more than you can say about the
last replacement headmaster Xaviers had, Magneto (And there were two student
deaths under his term in charge) D) Has shown a deep concern for keeping her
pupils alive.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

"Brian Doyle" <No_spam.TakeThisOut@freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
 > Justin Samuels wrote:
  > > The CEO of Boeing was recently fired from running the company in part
  > > due to an inappropriate affair he had with a female executive.
 >
 > I'd need to know a lot more details about that before accepting it as a
 > comparison, what was "inappropriate" about it?

1. He was married to someone else.
2. He was her superior (by definition, he was every employee's
superior).
3. They'd just made a big deal about holding to ethical behavior codes
at the company.

  > > Cyclops had an inappropriate affair with the White Queen, and then
  > > shacks up with her right after Phoenix's death.
 >
 > Again, define inappropriate.

He was married to someone else. Isn't every extramarital affair
inappropriate?

  > > The cuckoos have often commented on what a poor example the White
  > > Queen is
 >
 > Yeah, sure take the word of a group of pubescent telepaths with almost no
 > real life experience.

Who better to know?

If you're going to get rid of one of them, though, I think it should be
Cyclops. Emma's a much better teacher and leader than he is.

--
Johanna Draper Carlson
Reviews of Comics Worth Reading -- <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.comicsworthreading.com" target="_blank">http://www.comicsworthreading.com</a>
Blogging at <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.comicsworthreading.com/blog/cwr.html" target="_blank">http://www.comicsworthreading.com/blog/cwr.html</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

"Brian Doyle" <No_spam DeleteThis @freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:d3umd1$jq4$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
 >
  >> (along with a devious White Queen)
 >
 > Deviousness is not a crime

No its not, but Emma has committed plenty of other crimes. That's why she's
such an interesting choice for a teacher, precisely because of her
background. There has been a worrying trend for all the best villains to be
reformed and incorporated into the X-Men, but I think in Emma's case it
really is worth exploring.

In the cold light of day, no-one would pick Emma as a role model for their
kids if there were alternatives. But at the moment there aren't. Mutant
affairs tend to be driven by necessity.

The real question is, are Emma and Scott responsible people who will put the
protection of the kids above everything else. Both have shown they are
willing to, but then they are also both juggling other serious
responsiblities. That's conflict, and hopefully can be the source for some
interesting stories.

Nessy<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

Justin Samuels <viaong1.TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net> wrote in
news:4eA8e.94143$vK6.78000@bignews3.bellsouth.net:

 > I was thinking, there's almost no way in hell Cyclops should be
 > allowed to lead the X-Men.
 >
 > The CEO of Boeing was recently fired from running the company in part
 > due to an inappropriate affair he had with a female executive.

I need more details than that to make a comparison. Define
"inappropriate". Also, this isn't a corporation.

 > Cyclops had an inappropriate affair with the White Queen, and then
 > shacks up with her right after Phoenix's death.

The marriage was falling apart and he did something that he shouldn't
have done. As for after Jean's death, that's not anyone's business.

 > And we're supposed to believe not only do the X-Men except an insane
 > Cyclops (along with a devious White Queen) leading them, but that the
 > parents of the children are all okay with it?
 >
 > Yes, right.

And the choices are? I'm sure there are tons of mutant schools out
there for parents to choose from. No child has to go to that school.

 > The cuckoos have often commented on what a poor example the White
 > Queen is and how she is a danger to impressionable young students.
 > The cuckoos blamed her for the death's of Esme and Sophie.

They blame her, sure, but is she more at fault than anyone Xavier
himself "led to death"? What about Doug dying under Magneto's watch?
X-Men die. That's not just part of the lifestyle, but a very real
threat simply by being a mutant. The X-Men sure as heck didn't create
the Sentinels, Cassandra Nova was waiting in the wings for decades, and
Sublime is simply beyond anyone's ability to control. (Sublime was
ultimately responsible for the actions of anyone on Kick.)

 > so then why is such a woman allowed to lead the X-Men?

She doesn't lead the X-Men.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

"Andrew Ness" <nessy76.RemoveThis@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in
news:4262e469_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com:

 > "Brian Doyle" <No_spam.RemoveThis@freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
 > news:d3umd1$jq4$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
  >>
   >>> (along with a devious White Queen)
  >>
  >> Deviousness is not a crime
 >
 > No its not, but Emma has committed plenty of other crimes. That's why
 > she's such an interesting choice for a teacher, precisely because of
 > her background. There has been a worrying trend for all the best
 > villains to be reformed and incorporated into the X-Men, but I think
 > in Emma's case it really is worth exploring.

I think so, too, but mostly because her personality hasn't undergone a
complete change (like Rogue, for example, who suddenly became heroic the
second she stepped through the door at Xavier's). She's still Emma,
just no longer criminally inclined.

 > In the cold light of day, no-one would pick Emma as a role model for
 > their kids if there were alternatives. But at the moment there aren't.
 > Mutant affairs tend to be driven by necessity.

Agreed.

 > The real question is, are Emma and Scott responsible people who will
 > put the protection of the kids above everything else. Both have shown
 > they are willing to, but then they are also both juggling other
 > serious responsiblities. That's conflict, and hopefully can be the
 > source for some interesting stories.

I also think they will do whatever is possible to protect their charges.
That they're also human in their ability to make mistakes is what makes
them interesting.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

Johanna Draper Carlson <johannaNOSPAM.RemoveThis@comicsworthreading.com> wrote in
news:johannaNOSPAM-C51FFE.19410517042005@news.uswest.net:

 > "Brian Doyle" <No_spam.RemoveThis@freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
  >> Justin Samuels wrote:
   >> > The CEO of Boeing was recently fired from running the company in
   >> > part due to an inappropriate affair he had with a female executive.
  >>
  >> I'd need to know a lot more details about that before accepting it as
  >> a comparison, what was "inappropriate" about it?
 >
 > 1. He was married to someone else.

OK, so we've got Cyclops here.

 > 2. He was her superior (by definition, he was every employee's
 > superior).

Emma, Jean, and Scott were all on the same level, so this doesn't
compare.

 > 3. They'd just made a big deal about holding to ethical behavior codes
 > at the company.

The X-Men just don't even rate here. Magneto in charge while Chuck's
out of town? Hmm...


   >> > The cuckoos have often commented on what a poor example the White
   >> > Queen is
  >>
  >> Yeah, sure take the word of a group of pubescent telepaths with
  >> almost no real life experience.
 >
 > Who better to know?
 >
 > If you're going to get rid of one of them, though, I think it should
 > be Cyclops. Emma's a much better teacher and leader than he is.

I still wish that Jean had survived to take over. When Xavier
originally announced he would be stepping down he chose Jean to take his
place as headmistress. But, as you say, Emma is good at what she does.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

On Sun, 17 Apr 2005 19:41:05 -0400, Johanna Draper Carlson
<johannaNOSPAM.RemoveThis@comicsworthreading.com> wrote:
 > "Brian Doyle" <No_spam.RemoveThis@freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
  >> Justin Samuels wrote:
 >
   >> > Cyclops had an inappropriate affair with the White Queen, and then
   >> > shacks up with her right after Phoenix's death.
  >>
  >> Again, define inappropriate.
 >
 >He was married to someone else. Isn't every extramarital affair
 >inappropriate?

Speaking of the real world, if two people are separated but haven't
gotten divorced yet, I would not consider them getting involved with
other people to be particularly inappropriate. I've known people who
have delayed getting divorced just because it costs a lot of money.

-Ralf Haring
"The mind must be the harder, the heart the keener,
the spirit the greater, as our strength grows less."
-Byrhtwold, The Battle of Maldon<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

Ralf Haring <haring.DeleteThis@SPAMBLOCK.preypacer.com> wrote:

 > Speaking of the real world, if two people are separated but haven't
 > gotten divorced yet, I would not consider them getting involved with
 > other people to be particularly inappropriate.

If they have definitely started on the path to divorce, I don't, either.
But the marriage clearly has to be over, or you're in one of those
old-movie "yeah, yeah, sweetie, my wife and I are getting divorced any
day now" situations.

Dan McEwen <ferroboy.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote:

 > Emma, Jean, and Scott were all on the same level, so this doesn't
 > compare.

Oh, I know, I was just explaining the current events for those who
weren't familiar with them.

--
Johanna Draper Carlson
Reviews of Comics Worth Reading -- <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.comicsworthreading.com" target="_blank">http://www.comicsworthreading.com</a>
Blogging at <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.comicsworthreading.com/blog/cwr.html" target="_blank">http://www.comicsworthreading.com/blog/cwr.html</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

Justin Samuels wrote:
 > so then why is such a woman allowed to lead the X-Men?

Because the teenage male students would riot if they got rid of her ?
She teaches class in little more than her underwear!

Alex<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

"Alex Peckover" <alex.RemoveThis@SPAMOFF.uklinux.net> wrote in message
news:3chja3F6me1tjU1@individual.net...
 > Justin Samuels wrote:
  >> so then why is such a woman allowed to lead the X-Men?
 >
 > Because the teenage male students would riot if they got rid of her ? She
 > teaches class in little more than her underwear!

And when you consider that she can read all the thoughts of those teenage
boys, that raises some very interesting questions, doesn't it?

And the way Quitely drew her, that was substantially less than some people's
underwear.

NSY<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 00:13:35 -0400, Ralf Haring
<haring RemoveThis @SPAMBLOCK.preypacer.com> wrote:

 >On Sun, 17 Apr 2005 19:41:05 -0400, Johanna Draper Carlson
 ><johannaNOSPAM RemoveThis @comicsworthreading.com> wrote:
  >> "Brian Doyle" <No_spam RemoveThis @freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
   >>> Justin Samuels wrote:
  >>
   >>> > Cyclops had an inappropriate affair with the White Queen, and then
   >>> > shacks up with her right after Phoenix's death.
   >>>
   >>> Again, define inappropriate.
  >>
  >>He was married to someone else. Isn't every extramarital affair
  >>inappropriate?
 >
 >Speaking of the real world, if two people are separated but haven't
 >gotten divorced yet, I would not consider them getting involved with
 >other people to be particularly inappropriate. I've known people who
 >have delayed getting divorced just because it costs a lot of money.

In this case, it was inappropriate because it was supposed to
be...Scott has admitted as much and several of the other X-Men have
called him on it...Morrison was trying to emphasize the change
Apocalypse caused on the character and that is why he acted so out of
character (I know he left Maddie too but this is an entirely different
situation)...besides, we all know Jean will be back to stay around the
time X3 hits and it she and Scott will eventually get back together
(X-Men: the End is clearly not the end because several of Claremont's
future plots have already been invalidated)

 >
 >-Ralf Haring
 >"The mind must be the harder, the heart the keener,
 > the spirit the greater, as our strength grows less."
 > -Byrhtwold, The Battle of Maldon<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

Ralf Haring wrote:

 >Speaking of the real world, if two people are separated but haven't
 >gotten divorced yet, I would not consider them getting involved with
 >other people to be particularly inappropriate. I've known people who
 >have delayed getting divorced just because it costs a lot of money.
 >
 >

That may be, but in this case, the Boeing CEO was still married. After
news of the affair became public, though, his wife filed for divorce.
So *now* they're separated, but they weren't initially.

--

The majestic equality of the law forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.

Anatole France


Comic book klatch: <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://ibntumart.blogspot.com" target="_blank">http://ibntumart.blogspot.com</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach? 

Ralf Haring wrote:
 > On Sun, 17 Apr 2005 19:41:05 -0400, Johanna Draper Carlson
 > <johannaNOSPAM.DeleteThis@comicsworthreading.com> wrote:
 >
  >>"Brian Doyle" <No_spam.DeleteThis@freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
  >>
   >>>Justin Samuels wrote:
  >>
   >>>>Cyclops had an inappropriate affair with the White Queen, and then
   >>>>shacks up with her right after Phoenix's death.
   >>>
   >>>Again, define inappropriate.
  >>
  >>He was married to someone else. Isn't every extramarital affair
  >>inappropriate?
 >
 >
 > Speaking of the real world, if two people are separated but haven't
 > gotten divorced yet, I would not consider them getting involved with
 > other people to be particularly inappropriate. I've known people who
 > have delayed getting divorced just because it costs a lot of money.

Technically, of course, Cyclops doesn't have to divorce Jean. She's dead.

Alex<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Cyclops and the White Queen, unfit to teach?