Dinosaur people in Uncanny X-Men

Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
 > Karl Hiller wrote:
  >> ~consul wrote:
   >>> Terrafamilia wrote:
   >>>> Just wanted to ask of those who have the old Cross-Time Caper from
the
   >>>> old Excalibur handy, do these dinosaur people in the current
Uncanny
   >>>> appear to be the same type of dinosaur people who popped up in
   >>>> Excalibur? In that story there was a dinosaur version of the FF,
here
   >>>> I'm getting a dinosaur X-Men vibe.
   >>>
   >>> I don't have them handy, but I thought that the CTC ones were more
....
   >>> varied in the saurian types portrayed. These folks just seem to be
just,
   >>> what, velociraptor or something like that. I wonder if these folks
are
   >>> related, will they hook up with that tourist family still living in
   >>> England?
  >>
  >> How many dinosaur-people races *are* there in the MU under
Claremont's
  >> pen? I didn't read X-Treme, but wasn't there a race of dinosaur
people in
  >> that title? And the ones from near the end of Ms. Marvel (or were
they
  >> the same ones?)?
 >
 > I've read indications that the X-Treme saurians and the Ms. Marvel
ones are
 > one and the same. I don't have the Ms. Marvel issues to confirm,
though.

They are definitely the same.

 > As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
dinosaurs, so
 > he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that it's territory
he's
 > covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also well aware that he uses
mind
 > control a lot, but he doesn't offer much to justify that. At least
he's not
 > deluded, anyway.)

He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of comics.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Dinosaur people in Uncanny X-Men 

~consul wrote:
 > Terrafamilia wrote:
  > > Just wanted to ask of those who have the old Cross-Time Caper from the
  > > old Excalibur handy, do these dinosaur people in the current Uncanny
  > > appear to be the same type of dinosaur people who popped up in
  > > Excalibur? In that story there was a dinosaur version of the FF, here
  > > I'm getting a dinosaur X-Men vibe.

 > I don't have them handy, but I thought that the CTC ones were more ... varied in
 > the saurian types portrayed. These folks just seem to be just, what,
 > velociraptor or something like that. I wonder if these folks are related, will
 > they hook up with that tourist family still living in England?

How many dinosaur-people races *are* there in the MU under Claremont's
pen? I didn't read X-Treme, but wasn't there a race of dinosaur people in
that title? And the ones from near the end of Ms. Marvel (or were they
the same ones?)?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Dinosaur people in Uncanny X-Men 

"Karl Hiller" <kjhiller.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:112ncu07nvv0ndf@corp.supernews.com...
 > ~consul wrote:
  > > Terrafamilia wrote:
   > > > Just wanted to ask of those who have the old Cross-Time Caper from the
   > > > old Excalibur handy, do these dinosaur people in the current Uncanny
   > > > appear to be the same type of dinosaur people who popped up in
   > > > Excalibur? In that story there was a dinosaur version of the FF, here
   > > > I'm getting a dinosaur X-Men vibe.
 >
  > > I don't have them handy, but I thought that the CTC ones were more ...
varied in
  > > the saurian types portrayed. These folks just seem to be just, what,
  > > velociraptor or something like that. I wonder if these folks are
related, will
  > > they hook up with that tourist family still living in England?
 >
 > How many dinosaur-people races *are* there in the MU under Claremont's
 > pen? I didn't read X-Treme, but wasn't there a race of dinosaur people in
 > that title? And the ones from near the end of Ms. Marvel (or were they
 > the same ones?)?


I've read indications that the X-Treme saurians and the Ms. Marvel ones are
one and the same. I don't have the Ms. Marvel issues to confirm, though.

As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes dinosaurs, so
he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that it's territory he's
covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also well aware that he uses mind
control a lot, but he doesn't offer much to justify that. At least he's not
deluded, anyway.)

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"The Black Guardian" <blakgard DeleteThis @aol.com> wrote in message
news:1110168792.033586.17190@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
 > Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
  > > Karl Hiller wrote:
   > >> ~consul wrote:
   > >>> Terrafamilia wrote:
   > >>>> Just wanted to ask of those who have the old Cross-Time Caper from
 > the
   > >>>> old Excalibur handy, do these dinosaur people in the current
 > Uncanny
   > >>>> appear to be the same type of dinosaur people who popped up in
   > >>>> Excalibur? In that story there was a dinosaur version of the FF,
 > here
   > >>>> I'm getting a dinosaur X-Men vibe.
   > >>>
   > >>> I don't have them handy, but I thought that the CTC ones were more
 > ...
   > >>> varied in the saurian types portrayed. These folks just seem to be
 > just,
   > >>> what, velociraptor or something like that. I wonder if these folks
 > are
   > >>> related, will they hook up with that tourist family still living in
   > >>> England?
   > >>
   > >> How many dinosaur-people races *are* there in the MU under
 > Claremont's
   > >> pen? I didn't read X-Treme, but wasn't there a race of dinosaur
 > people in
   > >> that title? And the ones from near the end of Ms. Marvel (or were
 > they
   > >> the same ones?)?
  > >
  > > I've read indications that the X-Treme saurians and the Ms. Marvel
 > ones are
  > > one and the same. I don't have the Ms. Marvel issues to confirm,
 > though.
 >
 > They are definitely the same.
 >
  > > As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
 > dinosaurs, so
  > > he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that it's territory
 > he's
  > > covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also well aware that he uses
 > mind
  > > control a lot, but he doesn't offer much to justify that. At least
 > he's not
  > > deluded, anyway.)
 >
 > He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
 > fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of comics.
 >

He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well a LOT. It
doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he could lose to his
benefit.

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Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
 > The Black Guardian wrote:
  >> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   >>> As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
   >>> dinosaurs, so he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that
it's
   >>> territory he's covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also well
aware that
   >>> he uses mind control a lot, but he doesn't offer much to justify
that. At
   >>> least he's not deluded, anyway.)
  >>
  >> He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
  >> fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of
comics.
 >
 > He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well a
LOT. It
 > doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he could lose to
his
 > benefit.

He really doesn't "go to that well" any more than many, many writers
do. Mind control is more of an across the board comics cliche. In fact,
major storylines in both DC and Marvel comics are focusing on just this
thing, atm and over the summer.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Dinosaur people in Uncanny X-Men 

"The Black Guardian" <blakgard RemoveThis @aol.com> wrote in message
news:1110183645.870888.254610@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
 > Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
  > > The Black Guardian wrote:
   > >> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > >>> As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
   > >>> dinosaurs, so he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that
 > it's
   > >>> territory he's covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also well
 > aware that
   > >>> he uses mind control a lot, but he doesn't offer much to justify
 > that. At
   > >>> least he's not deluded, anyway.)
   > >>
   > >> He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
   > >> fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of
 > comics.
  > >
  > > He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well a
 > LOT. It
  > > doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he could lose to
 > his
  > > benefit.
 >
 > He really doesn't "go to that well" any more than many, many writers
 > do. Mind control is more of an across the board comics cliche. In fact,
 > major storylines in both DC and Marvel comics are focusing on just this
 > thing, atm and over the summer.
 >

No, I think Claremont does go to that well a hell of a lot. Here are his
storylines since the start of X-Treme.

X-Treme #1-4 - vs. Vargas, no mind control
X-Treme #5-9 - vs. Sebastian Shaw, Tessa & Rogue controlled
X-Treme #10-19 - vs. Khan, no mind control
X-Treme #20-23 - Schism, Bogan uses mind control
X-Treme #24 - Cannonball solo, no mind control
X-Treme #25-30 - GLMK II, mind control
X-Treme #31-35 - Intifada, Bogan uses mind control
X-Treme #36-39 - Arena, Storm is mind-controlled
X-Treme #40-45 - Eyes of Fire, Bogan uses mind control
X-Treme #46 - Final issue, no mind control
UXM #444-447 - The Fury controls Sage
UXM #448-449 - vs. Viper, no mind control
UXM #450-451 - X-23, no mind control
UXM #452-454 - Hellfire Club, no mind control
UXM #455+ - Savage Land, dinosaur mind controls Rachel

So out of 15 arcs, 8 have mind control. Some of those arcs are actually
single issue stories, and so hardly count. As I said, the mind control
thing doesn;t bother me particularly, but I can see why it does bother other
people.

--
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Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
 > The Black Guardian wrote:
  >> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   >>> The Black Guardian wrote:
   >>>> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   >>>>> As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
   >>>>> dinosaurs, so he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that
   >>>>> it's territory he's covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also
well
   >>>>> aware that he uses mind control a lot, but he doesn't offer much
to
   >>>>> justify that. At least he's not deluded, anyway.)
   >>>>
   >>>> He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
   >>>> fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of
   >>>> comics.
   >>>
   >>> He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well a
   >>> LOT. It doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he
could lose
   >>> to his benefit.
  >>
  >> He really doesn't "go to that well" any more than many, many writers
  >> do. Mind control is more of an across the board comics cliche. In
fact,
  >> major storylines in both DC and Marvel comics are focusing on just
this
  >> thing, atm and over the summer.
 >
 > No, I think Claremont does go to that well a hell of a lot. Here are
his
 > storylines since the start of X-Treme.

And Morrison's entire run was about mind control...
And Bendis' stories feature a lot of mind control...
And GL: Rebirth is about mind control...
And DC's summer crossover features mind control...
Etc.
Etc.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Dinosaur people in Uncanny X-Men 

"The Black Guardian" <blakgard RemoveThis @aol.com> wrote in message
news:1110240702.333302.79890@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
 >
 > Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
  > > The Black Guardian wrote:
   > >> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > >>> The Black Guardian wrote:
   > >>>> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > >>>>> As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
   > >>>>> dinosaurs, so he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that
   > >>>>> it's territory he's covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also
 > well
   > >>>>> aware that he uses mind control a lot, but he doesn't offer much
 > to
   > >>>>> justify that. At least he's not deluded, anyway.)
   > >>>>
   > >>>> He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
   > >>>> fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of
   > >>>> comics.
   > >>>
   > >>> He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well a
   > >>> LOT. It doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he
 > could lose
   > >>> to his benefit.
   > >>
   > >> He really doesn't "go to that well" any more than many, many writers
   > >> do. Mind control is more of an across the board comics cliche. In
 > fact,
   > >> major storylines in both DC and Marvel comics are focusing on just
 > this
   > >> thing, atm and over the summer.
  > >
  > > No, I think Claremont does go to that well a hell of a lot. Here are
 > his
  > > storylines since the start of X-Treme.
 >
 > And Morrison's entire run was about mind control...
 > And Bendis' stories feature a lot of mind control...
 > And GL: Rebirth is about mind control...
 > And DC's summer crossover features mind control...
 > Etc.
 > Etc.
 >

Curse your logic!

Morrison's arc I can retrofit to my own point of view, because he was just
doing riffs on all of the X-Men themes. Of course he was going to have mind
control, it's a staple! Looking at Morrison's other recent work, Seaguy had
some mind control, and I suppose We3 did as well...

What about Bendis? Chaos, check. He's used the Purple Man a bit as well,
hasn't he? Grrrr....

So yeah, mind control is used a fair bit across the board. I wonder, what
is it about Claremont's use of it that makes it stand out so much?

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Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
 > "The Black Guardian" <blakgard.DeleteThis@aol.com> wrote in message
 > news:1110240702.333302.79890@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
  > >
  > > Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > > > The Black Guardian wrote:
   > > >> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > > >>> The Black Guardian wrote:
   > > >>>> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > > >>>>> As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
   > > >>>>> dinosaurs, so he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware that
   > > >>>>> it's territory he's covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also
  > > well
   > > >>>>> aware that he uses mind control a lot, but he doesn't offer much
  > > to
   > > >>>>> justify that. At least he's not deluded, anyway.)
   > > >>>>
   > > >>>> He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot. In
   > > >>>> fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of
   > > >>>> comics.
   > > >>>
   > > >>> He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well a
   > > >>> LOT. It doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he
  > > could lose
   > > >>> to his benefit.
   > > >>
   > > >> He really doesn't "go to that well" any more than many, many writers
   > > >> do. Mind control is more of an across the board comics cliche. In
  > > fact,
   > > >> major storylines in both DC and Marvel comics are focusing on just
  > > this
   > > >> thing, atm and over the summer.
   > > >
   > > > No, I think Claremont does go to that well a hell of a lot. Here are
  > > his
   > > > storylines since the start of X-Treme.
  > >
  > > And Morrison's entire run was about mind control...
  > > And Bendis' stories feature a lot of mind control...
  > > And GL: Rebirth is about mind control...
  > > And DC's summer crossover features mind control...
  > > Etc.
  > > Etc.

 > Curse your logic!

 > Morrison's arc I can retrofit to my own point of view, because he was just
 > doing riffs on all of the X-Men themes. Of course he was going to have mind
 > control, it's a staple! Looking at Morrison's other recent work, Seaguy had
 > some mind control, and I suppose We3 did as well...

 > What about Bendis? Chaos, check. He's used the Purple Man a bit as well,
 > hasn't he? Grrrr....

 > So yeah, mind control is used a fair bit across the board. I wonder, what
 > is it about Claremont's use of it that makes it stand out so much?

Because when his characters get mind-controlled, there's always some tiny
buried portion of themselves that *wants* it to happen?

I think that's where it takes the first step from being a plot device into
something a LIT-tle bit kinkier...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Dinosaur people in Uncanny X-Men 

"Karl Hiller" <kjhiller DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:113v9c046b7st9e@corp.supernews.com...
 > Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
  > > "The Black Guardian" <blakgard DeleteThis @aol.com> wrote in message
  > > news:1110240702.333302.79890@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
   > > >
   > > > Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > > > > The Black Guardian wrote:
   > > > >> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > > > >>> The Black Guardian wrote:
   > > > >>>> Nathan P. Mahney wrote:
   > > > >>>>> As for the others, Claremont has indicated that he just likes
   > > > >>>>> dinosaurs, so he uses them a fair bit. He's also well aware
that
   > > > >>>>> it's territory he's covered before. (Funnily enough, he's also
   > > > well
   > > > >>>>> aware that he uses mind control a lot, but he doesn't offer much
   > > > to
   > > > >>>>> justify that. At least he's not deluded, anyway.)
   > > > >>>>
   > > > >>>> He's certainly not the only writer who uses mind control a lot.
In
   > > > >>>> fact, mind control is pretty much a staple of the majority of
   > > > >>>> comics.
   > > > >>>
   > > > >>> He's not the only one, no. But he certainly does go to that well
a
   > > > >>> LOT. It doesn't bother me a great deal, but it's something he
   > > > could lose
   > > > >>> to his benefit.
   > > > >>
   > > > >> He really doesn't "go to that well" any more than many, many
writers
   > > > >> do. Mind control is more of an across the board comics cliche. In
   > > > fact,
   > > > >> major storylines in both DC and Marvel comics are focusing on just
   > > > this
   > > > >> thing, atm and over the summer.
   > > > >
   > > > > No, I think Claremont does go to that well a hell of a lot. Here
are
   > > > his
   > > > > storylines since the start of X-Treme.
   > > >
   > > > And Morrison's entire run was about mind control...
   > > > And Bendis' stories feature a lot of mind control...
   > > > And GL: Rebirth is about mind control...
   > > > And DC's summer crossover features mind control...
   > > > Etc.
   > > > Etc.
 >
  > > Curse your logic!
 >
  > > Morrison's arc I can retrofit to my own point of view, because he was
just
  > > doing riffs on all of the X-Men themes. Of course he was going to have
mind
  > > control, it's a staple! Looking at Morrison's other recent work, Seaguy
had
  > > some mind control, and I suppose We3 did as well...
 >
  > > What about Bendis? Chaos, check. He's used the Purple Man a bit as
well,
  > > hasn't he? Grrrr....
 >
  > > So yeah, mind control is used a fair bit across the board. I wonder,
what
  > > is it about Claremont's use of it that makes it stand out so much?
 >
 > Because when his characters get mind-controlled, there's always some tiny
 > buried portion of themselves that *wants* it to happen?
 >
 > I think that's where it takes the first step from being a plot device into
 > something a LIT-tle bit kinkier...


well, with Rachel, that's pretty much her whole thing, really. being
mind-controlled. by Ahab, by Selene, by the Phoenix Force, by Mojo, by
Bogan, now the dino-people. People over at X-fan are bitching that she's
better at her job than that, but really, what's the evidence? when HASN'T
she been mind-controlled, for more than a few issues at a time? i imagine
there IS some part of her that wants it, considering how often it's done to
her, and that she's been trained from a very young age to be susceptible to
it.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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