The End of Eternity

On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 21:08:31 UTC, Tim Bruening
<tsbrueni.TakeThisOut@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:

> I have heard many politicians express opposition to wasting taxpayer money on
> space when there are so many problems at home to solve. Few politicians can see
> a decade into the future, let alone 12.5 million years!

I have never seen a politician that could think past his/her next
election let alone the next decade.


--
Robert Blair
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

David Johnston wrote:

> On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 14:54:32 -0700, Tim Bruening
> <tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Howard Brazee wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:13:54 -0700, Tim Bruening
> >> <tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Noys Lambent said that Eternity had prevented the Galactic Empire, and lead
> >> >to the extinction of the human race by keeping it trapped on Earth for 12.5
> >> >million years until intelligent species had evolved throughout the galaxy!
> >>
> >> While the solution could very well be best, it doesn't fit with human
> >> nature. Political people who recognize the problem would change
> >> their goals - to produce a dominant space going civilization, and
> >> still be in charge.
> >
> >Another issue: When Cooper found himself in the 20th century, he put an
> >ad in one of Harlan's favorite periodicals to attract his attention so
> >that Eternity could send a rescue mission. Cooper's ad read:
> >
> >ALL THE
> >TALK
> >OF THE
> >MARKET
> >
> >against the backdrop of the outline of an atomic bomb mushroom cloud.
> >This got Harlan's attention because of the word "ATOM" going down the
> >front and because of the mushroom cloud in a magazine issue dated March
> >28, 1932. (In the Eternity timeline, atomic bombs weren't detonated
> >until the 30th century!).
> >
> >The ad also gave Cooper's address as "Investments Newsletter, P.O. Box
> >14, Denver Colorado". Why didn't the ad also list Cooper's name as an
> >additional flag to Harlan?
> >
> >I wonder what people would have been investing in anyway? After all,
> >the U.S. was in a Great Depression!
>
> The Great Depression was a good time to buy in.

But who had enough money to invest?
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

Robert Blair wrote:

> On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 21:08:31 UTC, Tim Bruening
> <tsbrueni.RemoveThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>
> > I have heard many politicians express opposition to wasting taxpayer money on
> > space when there are so many problems at home to solve. Few politicians can see
> > a decade into the future, let alone 12.5 million years!
>
> I have never seen a politician that could think past his/her next
> election let alone the next decade.

Al Gore seems to be thinking about global warming several decades hence.
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

John Fairhurst wrote:

> In article <4opke2dbm5is9n2fbfimj86p1q5mnf75a7.RemoveThis@4ax.com>, Howard Brazee <howard.RemoveThis@brazee.net> wrote:
> >On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:13:54 -0700, Tim Bruening
> ><tsbrueni.RemoveThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >
> >>Noys Lambent said that Eternity had prevented the Galactic Empire, and lead
> >>to the extinction of the human race by keeping it trapped on Earth for 12.5
> >>million years until intelligent species had evolved throughout the galaxy!
> >
> >While the solution could very well be best, it doesn't fit with human
> >nature. Political people who recognize the problem would change
> >their goals - to produce a dominant space going civilization, and
> >still be in charge.
>
> The societies that tried for space travelling civilisations were found by
> Eternity to be high drug using and eventually collapse due to Mankind being
> locked in a virtually barren solar system. Eternity didn't select for a
> civilisation that would see space as a proper challange, instead going for a
> solution that appeared to give the widest satisfaction to the widest number of
> people.

What changes would you make in 20th century history to reduce drug addiction?
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:08:45 -0700, Tim Bruening
<tsbrueni.RemoveThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:


>> >I wonder what people would have been investing in anyway? After all,
>> >the U.S. was in a Great Depression!
>>
>> The Great Depression was a good time to buy in.
>
>But who had enough money to invest?

There were quite a few comfortably set people during the depression
in the United States.
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:22:42 -0700, Tim Bruening
<tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:

>
>
>John Fairhurst wrote:
>
>> In article <4opke2dbm5is9n2fbfimj86p1q5mnf75a7.DeleteThis@4ax.com>, Howard Brazee <howard.DeleteThis@brazee.net> wrote:
>> >On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:13:54 -0700, Tim Bruening
>> ><tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>> >
>> >>Noys Lambent said that Eternity had prevented the Galactic Empire, and lead
>> >>to the extinction of the human race by keeping it trapped on Earth for 12.5
>> >>million years until intelligent species had evolved throughout the galaxy!
>> >
>> >While the solution could very well be best, it doesn't fit with human
>> >nature. Political people who recognize the problem would change
>> >their goals - to produce a dominant space going civilization, and
>> >still be in charge.
>>
>> The societies that tried for space travelling civilisations were found by
>> Eternity to be high drug using and eventually collapse due to Mankind being
>> locked in a virtually barren solar system. Eternity didn't select for a
>> civilisation that would see space as a proper challange, instead going for a
>> solution that appeared to give the widest satisfaction to the widest number of
>> people.
>
>What changes would you make in 20th century history to reduce drug addiction?

Prevent the wars for a start. Without the wars fewer soldiers will
be exposed to free samples of morphine, heroin, and yes, tobacco. And
without the postwar population boom, there is no 60s. But of course
the wars also spurred the development of rocket technology.
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

David Johnston wrote:

> On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:22:42 -0700, Tim Bruening
> <tsbrueni.TakeThisOut@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >John Fairhurst wrote:
> >
> >> In article <4opke2dbm5is9n2fbfimj86p1q5mnf75a7.TakeThisOut@4ax.com>, Howard Brazee <howard.TakeThisOut@brazee.net> wrote:
> >> >On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:13:54 -0700, Tim Bruening
> >> ><tsbrueni.TakeThisOut@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>Noys Lambent said that Eternity had prevented the Galactic Empire, and lead
> >> >>to the extinction of the human race by keeping it trapped on Earth for 12.5
> >> >>million years until intelligent species had evolved throughout the galaxy!
> >> >
> >> >While the solution could very well be best, it doesn't fit with human
> >> >nature. Political people who recognize the problem would change
> >> >their goals - to produce a dominant space going civilization, and
> >> >still be in charge.
> >>
> >> The societies that tried for space travelling civilisations were found by
> >> Eternity to be high drug using and eventually collapse due to Mankind being
> >> locked in a virtually barren solar system. Eternity didn't select for a
> >> civilisation that would see space as a proper challange, instead going for a
> >> solution that appeared to give the widest satisfaction to the widest number of
> >> people.
> >
> >What changes would you make in 20th century history to reduce drug addiction?
>
> Prevent the wars for a start. Without the wars fewer soldiers will
> be exposed to free samples of morphine, heroin, and yes, tobacco. And
> without the postwar population boom, there is no 60s. But of course
> the wars also spurred the development of rocket technology.

Which wars would you prevent, and how?
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

Robert Blair wrote:
> On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:19:24 UTC, Tim Bruening
> <tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>
> > > > I have heard many politicians express opposition to wasting taxpayer money on
> > > > space when there are so many problems at home to solve. Few politicians can see
> > > > a decade into the future, let alone 12.5 million years!
> > >
> > > I have never seen a politician that could think past his/her next
> > > election let alone the next decade.
> >
> > Al Gore seems to be thinking about global warming several decades hence.
>
> Only because he thinks it will get him elected.

Elected to what?
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

Robert Blair wrote:
> On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:19:24 UTC, Tim Bruening
> <tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> > > I have never seen a politician that could think past his/her next
> > > election let alone the next decade.
> >
> > Al Gore seems to be thinking about global warming several decades hence.
>
> Only because he thinks it will get him elected. If it was not such a
> current hot topic he would completely ignore it.

(a) Elected to what?

(b) Gore has been fighting global warming for 30+ years. If global
warming has actually been a political hot topic for three decades that
people think will get them elected, as you suggest, why has nothing
been done?

--
Justin Alexander
http://www.thealexandrian.net
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

Mike Schilling wrote:
> Though the idea that preventing the crises and disasters we're familiar with
> wouldn't have caused others, perhaps as awful, is overly optimistic (or
> pessimistic, depending on how you look at it.)

Sure. But if you can just keep making changes, tweaking and reversing
and playing around as you go, you should be able to eventually keep
history on a fairly even keel. Not entirely free of violence, perhaps,
but almost certainly free of serious conflagration.

--
Justin Alexander
http://www.thealexandrian.net
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:53:36 -0700, Tim Bruening
<tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:

>
>
>David Johnston wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:22:42 -0700, Tim Bruening
>> <tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >John Fairhurst wrote:
>> >
>> >> In article <4opke2dbm5is9n2fbfimj86p1q5mnf75a7 DeleteThis @4ax.com>, Howard Brazee <howard DeleteThis @brazee.net> wrote:
>> >> >On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:13:54 -0700, Tim Bruening
>> >> ><tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >>Noys Lambent said that Eternity had prevented the Galactic Empire, and lead
>> >> >>to the extinction of the human race by keeping it trapped on Earth for 12.5
>> >> >>million years until intelligent species had evolved throughout the galaxy!
>> >> >
>> >> >While the solution could very well be best, it doesn't fit with human
>> >> >nature. Political people who recognize the problem would change
>> >> >their goals - to produce a dominant space going civilization, and
>> >> >still be in charge.
>> >>
>> >> The societies that tried for space travelling civilisations were found by
>> >> Eternity to be high drug using and eventually collapse due to Mankind being
>> >> locked in a virtually barren solar system. Eternity didn't select for a
>> >> civilisation that would see space as a proper challange, instead going for a
>> >> solution that appeared to give the widest satisfaction to the widest number of
>> >> people.
>> >
>> >What changes would you make in 20th century history to reduce drug addiction?
>>
>> Prevent the wars for a start. Without the wars fewer soldiers will
>> be exposed to free samples of morphine, heroin, and yes, tobacco. And
>> without the postwar population boom, there is no 60s. But of course
>> the wars also spurred the development of rocket technology.
>
>Which wars would you prevent, and how?

All the major ones.
World War I is easy to prevent. While the balkans were a tinderbox
waiting for a match, all you have to do is blow out all the matches.
If you're a time traveller, that's no so hard. That prevents the
Russian Revolution in the short term, and if you can encourage a
continuing gradual liberalisation of Russia you can end up with
something more stable and less aggressive. The Sino-Japanese war
could be avoided by quietly steering certain Japanese officers away
from a life in the military. Without World War I and the Russian
Revolution, there is no Hitler and no Stalin so it's hard to say what
hypothetical conflicts you might have to nip in the bud. I'm not sure
how to prevent Mussolini's inept adventures in empire building but you
might not to. Instead you might just want to make sure they go even
worse, discrediting both him and neo-colonialism.
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:19:24 UTC, Tim Bruening
<tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:

> > > I have heard many politicians express opposition to wasting taxpayer money on
> > > space when there are so many problems at home to solve. Few politicians can see
> > > a decade into the future, let alone 12.5 million years!
> >
> > I have never seen a politician that could think past his/her next
> > election let alone the next decade.
>
> Al Gore seems to be thinking about global warming several decades hence.

Only because he thinks it will get him elected. If it was not such a
current hot topic he would completely ignore it.


--
Robert Blair
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity 

In article <dhdue2dcfe0j7bj94efap3ir898l9bbcrd.TakeThisOut@4ax.com>,
rgorman.TakeThisOut@block.net says...
> All the major ones.
> World War I is easy to prevent. While the balkans were a tinderbox
> waiting for a match, all you have to do is blow out all the matches.
> If you're a time traveller, that's no so hard. That prevents the
> Russian Revolution in the short term, and if you can encourage a
> continuing gradual liberalisation of Russia you can end up with
> something more stable and less aggressive. The Sino-Japanese war
> could be avoided by quietly steering certain Japanese officers away
> from a life in the military. Without World War I and the Russian
> Revolution, there is no Hitler and no Stalin so it's hard to say what
> hypothetical conflicts you might have to nip in the bud. I'm not sure
> how to prevent Mussolini's inept adventures in empire building but you
> might not to. Instead you might just want to make sure they go even
> worse, discrediting both him and neo-colonialism.

some good points, here. personally, i think mussolini would never have
been signficant without Hitler...
 >> Stay informed about: The End of Eternity