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Willowhugger

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Since: Feb 19, 2007
Posts: 48



(Msg. 1) Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 10:40 am
Post subject: The Fan-Review thread
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I thought it'd be a fun idea to have a thread devoted to fan reviews
of books. Basically, you do up a review of any of the Honorverse
books or short stories then give your opinions upon it. Why you liked
or disliked it and in the end, give a 1/10 rating of the novel.

We've all had very large discussions of various books in this set but
I always enjoy hearing other fan's thoughts about the actual novels.

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Willowhugger

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(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 6:57 am
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On Basilisk Station

Review 1#

By. Charles Phipps

Why not begin where it all began? On Basilisk Station was my
introduction into the Honor Harrington series only recently when a
friend recommended the book series to me and there was a bunch of
David Weber books on the book shelf at my local store. I had a
fondness for space opera but hadn't really heard much about the
series. I was worried, completely unjustified in the end, that it
would prove to be just another generic science fiction series.
However, I had a little extra money and needed something to read while
I wrote my latest attempt at science fiction superstardom.

I won't be entirely complimentry in this work because while it's not
my least favorite of the Honorverse books, I enjoyed the direction
that David took in later works. I'll list both my criticisms, which
should be taken with a grain of salt since David Weber is a hugely
successful author while I am not, along with my compliments.

What strikes me most about this story is this *is* probably my
favorite portrayal of Honor Harrington along with "Honor Amongst
Enemies." At heart, Honor works best for me when she's the
combination of Nelson, Pollyanna, and Charlie Brown. A rather curious
combination but what essentially boils down to as liking her most when
our plucky heroine (and she is plucky) is down and out yet determined
to make the most of her situation. It's one of the main complaints
that I have about books where Honor is beloved and accepted by those
around her. Somehow, I just like her better when she has Spiderman's
problem of no luck but bad.

I appreciate David Weber reversing the cliche of someone assigned to
the ass-end of space only to thwart a major disaster in order to
redeem herself. Honor Harrington certainly does so at the climax but
she successfully managed to turn it around well before that moment
arrived. It's nice to also see a Captain whose not laid back in
fiction either. Honor Harrington cracks the whip in this book and
that's what gets the best results from her Navy rather than any touchy
feely goodness you might get from Star Trek.

I'm not terribly fond of the portrayal of the People's Republic of
Haven during this story but they serve as serviceable villains.
Frankly, they just don't pick up steam until Pierre's rebellion.
They're venal, conquest minded, and greedy but not really terrifying.
The board meeting just doesn't invoke much menace. I do appreciate
the "Stealing from Paul to pay Peter" nature of their need for
conquest. There's something actually more believable about their
ruthless willingness to delay paying the masses their Welfare check by
going to war than High Ridge's incompetent handling of everything.

Honestly, I think that my least favorite part of the story had to do
with the Native revolt. While the Havenite plan makes a certain
amount of sense, we never get to meet the savages in the same manner
that we get to meet the Masadans. Given Honor Harrington is stuck on
her spaceship the entire time, the totally liquored up guys with
firearms don't really present much in the way of menace that they
could have been. However, barring a ridiculous "Captain Kirk goes
down to the planet" moment, I don't see how it could have been
resolved.

I wish that Hauptman had returned as an eternal thorn in Honor
Harrington's side. Part of what makes his appearance here so good is
the fact that Honor is a stickler for the rules and in other
circumstances, I'd be entirely on the side of the cartel owner for
enforcing regulations that no one should really care about. I admit
that I was shocked by the "booty" reward system of Manticore when I
first read about it. It added an interesting dimension to the Star
Kingdom (along with dueling) that made me think this rule is probably
abused a great deal by Captains seeking to make money.

I also enjoy Honor Harrington's distaste for Horrible Hemphill because
even reading this book for the first time, it's obvious that Honor was
dead wrong about the Admiral. While the gravity lance certainly
didn't work, the philosophy of greatly expanding one's technology to
deal with an enemy is such a fundamental doctrine of war that it makes
young Commander Harrington look rather silly. The fact that the book
series went on to prove Honor's views on Miss Hemphill to be
outstandingly wrong was also a nice stick to her. Again, I keep
wishing that she'd stayed Miss Harrington's enemy though.

Honor's problem with her command starved XO is resolved in the end but
it also struck me as a very good piece of real Navy stuck into the
book. Fundamentally, there are a lot of very good second in commands
that routinely get passed over for promotion because they're just not
dynamic enough by comparison to other wundkinds out of the Academy.
His distaste is petty and he knows it. It's tragic really that we
didn't get to see Admiral Harrington and him in second in command at
more loggerheads.

(Dang, I just keep wanting to set the entire universe against our
heroine don't I?)

One complaint, that may or may not sound silly was that I did find the
rape subplot to be rather....vexing. While its certainly empowering
to have Honor Harrington kick around the sleazeball, it did seem
rather upsetting to see it included at all. There's no reason that
Pavel Young couldn't have been a superior who was an utter rotter
without actually attempting to insert the fact that he tried to
sexually assault her.

Overall, I very enjoyed this work and it immediately caused me to pick
up as many copies of the book as possible.

8/10

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Willowhugger

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Since: Feb 19, 2007
Posts: 48



(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 3:57 pm
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> Deck Load Strike, by Roland J. Green

I must confess that I'm very fond of this story because it struck me
as a perfect example of a proxy war. The storyline was pretty much
wall to wall action and the players themselves didn't matter so much
other than it was the People's Republic of Haven versus the Manticore
without the two actually exchanging blows against one another.

The savagery of the whole thing was also especially noteworthy.

Good review.

-Charles Phipps
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raguleader

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Since: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 583



(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:47 pm
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Willowhugger wrote:
> I thought it'd be a fun idea to have a thread devoted to fan reviews
> of books. Basically, you do up a review of any of the Honorverse
> books or short stories then give your opinions upon it. Why you liked
> or disliked it and in the end, give a 1/10 rating of the novel.
>
> We've all had very large discussions of various books in this set but
> I always enjoy hearing other fan's thoughts about the actual novels.

Deck Load Strike, by Roland J. Green

This story, from "Worlds of Honor", is an example of a short story that
just doesn't quite fit in the Honorverse, but it at least gets it a lot
closer than some other stories do. The action centers around a
proxy-war in the making on the planet Sylvestra, a faraway neobarb world
whose primary exports are fish and lumber (both of which are found in
plentiful supply on Sylvestra).

On the one side, the Republic of Canmore, the descendants of Celtic
settlers, the weaker of the two powers, being supported by advisory
missions from the Star Kingdom of Manticore and the Republic of Erewhon
(which is, on paper at least, neutral in the conflict). On the other
side, in the Kingdom of Chuiban, the Peoples' Republic of Haven is
supporting a noble (whose name I forget, was it Euphonovan?), who is the
son of a Andermani warlord and a Chubani princess, in his goal of
conquering Canmore.

The Republic has supplied their faction with tanks, aircraft, and
weapons, while the young prince commands a sizable army of his own (even
if the quality of the members of this army lack, even by sagging
Havenite standards). The Manties and Erewhonese are fare more strapped
for resources, and have to depend on the what resources the Republic of
Canmore can provide: Ungainly fishing boats, unreliable air freighters,
and three hundred men in warpaint and kilts.

The Peeps obviously don't have a chance.

The Good: Logistics are a central part of this story, and it was fun to
watch the two advisory groups try to pull together what they needed to
launch their attacks on the other side. On the one side, you had the
advisers with almost no resources of their own, and a client state more
than willing to provide everything it has when needed. On the other
side, the advisers with all the weapons and matériel they could wish
for, but a client who might give them the time of day if they were all
standing in a watch factory, and who's strategic preparations leave much
to be asked for.

The raid itself was also very well done, with the Sea Fencibles
attempting to destroy Euphonovan's equipment before his army arrives
later in the day. This is the only time we see large-scale infantry
combat in an inhabited area, other than the various coups in Nouveau Paris.

The Bad: Some more care could have been taken to keep this in line with
series continuity, as the Manticorans and Peeps had not been fighting
each other before Erewhon joined the Alliance. The political situation
in Chuiban was also hard to make out, with the King's position on
matters never made clear until it has become apparent that the Havenite
cause on the planet is lost.

It is never adequately explained why the citizen commissioner did not
recall the Captain with the pinnace. They may have been out of radio
contact for some reason, but we never find out.

Overall, an excellent story, with only a handful of minor problems.

--
--Jeffrey MacHott

"Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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raguleader

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Since: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 583



(Msg. 5) Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 12:36 am
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Willowhugger wrote:
>> Deck Load Strike, by Roland J. Green
>
> I must confess that I'm very fond of this story because it struck me
> as a perfect example of a proxy war. The storyline was pretty much
> wall to wall action and the players themselves didn't matter so much
> other than it was the People's Republic of Haven versus the Manticore
> without the two actually exchanging blows against one another.
>
> The savagery of the whole thing was also especially noteworthy.
>
> Good review.
>
> -Charles Phipps

I liked the bit about the "Universal Brotherhood of People Who Know That
Bullets Hurt", and the parallels between the two groups of advisers was
interesting as well. If a Manticoran adviser sleeps with a local, it's
looked upon as a minor concern not worth dwelling on. If a Havenite
adviser does the same, it constitutes a serious security risk. Also,
the two leaders of the Advisory mission from Haven could barely stand
each other, while the two leaders of the Mantie/Erewhon mission... well,
they could stand eachother a lot.

And of course, the leadership of the two missions both died for their
causes, the seconds-in-command even going so far as to kill each other
at the same time.

The main thing that bugged me was how the Nautilus was able to haul
serious ass and just about outrun the air freighters she had launched
several hours previously to get to shore.

--
--Jeffrey MacHott

"Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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John Palmer

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Since: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 44



(Msg. 6) Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:08 am
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On 24 Feb 2007 06:57 "Willowhugger" <charlie_the_cat_pooka.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:

>One complaint, that may or may not sound silly was that I did find the
>rape subplot to be rather....vexing. While its certainly empowering
>to have Honor Harrington kick around the sleazeball, it did seem
>rather upsetting to see it included at all. There's no reason that
>Pavel Young couldn't have been a superior who was an utter rotter
>without actually attempting to insert the fact that he tried to
>sexually assault her.

Since the storyline was to present late British Empire Sail era in a SF setting,
it was needed to exemplify how some parts of the nobility believed that the
lower classes had no rights that the nobility were bound to honor.
The rape attempt was (by canon) an act to put Honor down in her place (groveling
at her better's ankles).
Raping Honor, the poisoning of Nimitz (IIRC it was supposed to have killed him,
but didn't) were things that the lower classes were supposed to be subject to,
at least in some of the nobles (as demonstrated by this and many activities by
the Conservative Association) opinions.
Could the storyarc have gotten by without it? Possibly, but then they would have
needed something else to establish that degree of less-than-human, or at least
less worthy of possesing rights, than the Noble class in eyes of some members of
that nobility.
-
John Palmer
jhn1.RemoveThis@hotmail.com (swap one for 1)
"That was the best pep talk ever", Sergeant Schlock
http://www.schlockmercenary.com/d/20030608.html
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Willowhugger

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(Msg. 7) Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:13 am
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The Honor of the Queen

By. Charles Phipps

I must confess this is probably my least favorite of the Honor
Harrington books and I keep wondering if I shouldn't re-read it in
light of the revelations that we get about the Graysons because my
initial read was colored by a fantastic hatred for them. They just
rubbed me the wrong way in absolutely every single instance that they
appeared.

I don't think I was fully able to appreciate the deep differences
between Masada and Grayson on my first read through. My take was that
both were backwards neo-barbs and really weren't worth either Star
kingdom or Haven time. David was successful in convincing me that the
Masadans were MORE repulsive but he didn't do quite as good a job in
this book to making me like the Graysons.

(Actually, I didn't start to like the Graysons until the introduction
of Miranda. She oddly remains my favorite Grayson despite her short
page time)

It definitely was successful in establishing that Haven had no moral
credibility whatsoever by making them ally with the Masadans. It's
interesting to note that even the Havenites are repulsed by the
Masadans. The acts of brutality that are committed amongst the young
women of the Manticore crews are enough to make you want to wish that
they would break the Convention on orbital bombardment.

I do have a question though as to whether or not the Masadans really
did fully intend to annihilate the Graysons if their interior coup
failed. I think it would have been interesting to see the Solarian
League enforce their edict. I always assumed that the punishment for
using weapons of mass destruction was to have your own destruction
ensued without mercy or remorse.

Frankly, its a bit difficult to imagine that the Masadans could
honestly be so utterly backyard in morality yet have such advanced
technology. On the other hand, religion is a powerful motivating tool
(though later depictions of Masada seem to indicate that they honestly
don't have much in the way of religion BUT their misogyny----that
actually puts them beneath the Taliban as impossible as it may seem)

Honor Harrington is well depicted in this story and I liked the fact
that she's not yet so invincible or beloved that she's immune to
making mistakes or possesses much in the way of defenses to her
character. Honor has won one combat encounter with the Havenites and
that makes her notable but doesn't actually mean she's warranted any
real respect from most people.

I just happen to love Reginald Houseman and somehow I hope he manages
to become Prime Minister because I believe he's a great deal smarter
than the majority of people around him. He's a lot more dangerous
than High Ridge as well despite being an arrogant bureaucrat with
contempt for the military.

Frankly, I imagine that aside from his suggestion that the Masadans
can be negotiate with...I imagine he's probably usually very
successful at what he does. Seriously, stick Houseman in the Talbott
Cluster and the entire place would have been running smoothly with
economic alliances for everyone's benefit. He's just in the worst
situation for a man who doesn't believe in religion over money.

Honor's reaction to the man is based upon the heat of the moment and
frankly was impolitic. The fellow's fright is tremendous in the
period but understandable given the circumstances. I wish it had
manifested itself as some vengeance against her other than
accidentally getting her a new command in 'Honor Amongst Enemies.'

The difference between Manticorean technology and the technology of
her enemies first starts making an appearance here for better or
worse. I've never been a big fan of the fact that the Manties have
this huge tech advantage that allows them to role over the majority of
their enemies like Japan vs. Russia. However, David is smart enough
to have the Manties slaughtered at first by the Havenites to show that
they're not nearly the pushovers that you might initially make out
from later nasty victories by the bad guys.

Overall, I still enjoyed this book despite my own lack of sympathy for
the "good" guys.

6/10
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raguleader

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Since: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 583



(Msg. 8) Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:09 am
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Willowhugger wrote:
> *Short Story Reviews*
>
> What Price Dreams
>
> By. David Weber
>
> I admit that I've always thought of the Cats as a gimmick. Something
> cute and furry that spices up an otherwise dry naval series. Nimitz
> was able to get my girlfriend into the books even though she doesn't
> much care for the books. However, it's interesting to see how they
> remain at the center of important plots like this.

As far as I could tell, Nimitz in the first book served to show Honor's
emotions, since she, as a highly professional military officer,
wouldn't. More than one character was taking his cues from Nimitz when
presenting Honor with new, possibly unpleasant information.

> ***
>
> Queen's Gambit
>
> by Jane Lindskold
>
> It's ending was surprising but fits within what we know of the Queen.
> The Queen shows awesome leniency (note, I don't say mercy) to the
> traitors in her ranks. Something that I bet she regrets she chose to
> do. In the end, all her mercy did was allow two of her father's
> murderers to go free.
>
> I somehow think the modern Elizabeth Winton would have just offed
> their heads and damn the consequences.
>
> 9/10

My favorite thing in the story was Earl North Hollow explaining why he
supported the Queen against Haven, despite very much not liking the
Queen at all. If the Havenites succeed, he looses all of his power and
privilege, and the Queen was in the best position to keep that from
happening, at least as far as the political pre-game went.

--
--Jeffrey MacHott

"Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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raguleader

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Since: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 583



(Msg. 9) Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:28 am
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Willowhugger wrote:
> The Honor of the Queen
>
> By. Charles Phipps
>

> It definitely was successful in establishing that Haven had no moral
> credibility whatsoever by making them ally with the Masadans. It's
> interesting to note that even the Havenites are repulsed by the
> Masadans. The acts of brutality that are committed amongst the young
> women of the Manticore crews are enough to make you want to wish that
> they would break the Convention on orbital bombardment.

This book made me start liking the Peeps, as we saw that, at least once
you got low enough down the ranks, they were still good people, and that
despite any relative deficiencies compared to the Manties, they're still
leagues above most other militaries you'd come up against. Despite
having a well-planned mutiny on their hands, they hit the ground running
and managed to spike the guns (and blow up a boat bay, IIRC) before they
took their leave of the ship. The Havenite Marines in particular come
off as highly professional and good at their job (which we only rarely
ever get to see them do in the series).

> The difference between Manticorean technology and the technology of
> her enemies first starts making an appearance here for better or
> worse. I've never been a big fan of the fact that the Manties have
> this huge tech advantage that allows them to role over the majority of
> their enemies like Japan vs. Russia. However, David is smart enough
> to have the Manties slaughtered at first by the Havenites to show that
> they're not nearly the pushovers that you might initially make out
> from later nasty victories by the bad guys.

Well, Manties vs. the Masadans is like the US Air Force flying F-16s
against a third would country flying MiG-17s, it's not even fair.
During the First Battle of Yeltsin, a single Mantie destroyer put much
of the Masadan line of battle through a meat grinder before she was
overwhelmed by their Peep BC (what was it called? Thunder of God?)
When the other destroyer showed up with a pair of cruisers (and the
remnants of the Grayson Space Navy), they were able to turn the entire
Masadan navy into happy meals faster than they could say "Are these
cooked in Trans fat?"

That said, Manties vs. Havenites tends to be a bit more even, with the
Manties having the edge one-to-one in similar ships. Against a sole
Peep BC, with a relatively inexperienced crew, two Manticoran warships
with well-drilled and led crews were only able to fight her to a
standstill, and would have suffered outright defeat if White Haven
hadn't arrived with his squadron of BC's. As it was, all the BC's did
was goad the Masadan commander into making a severe tactical error in a
moment of panic, turning away from the BCs and towards a very angry
Manticoran cruiser skipper who didn't even know what was going on
anymore, and still had a partially functioning broadside looking for a
target.

Later on, we see the Havenites use clever strategy and tactics (and
overwhelming numbers) to overcome Manticoran technology on numerous
occasions, with even Commodore Harrington, the infamously clever Butcher
of Basilisk, boldly walking into an ambush and being captured.

--
--Jeffrey MacHott

"Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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fburton

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Since: Aug 18, 2004
Posts: 411



(Msg. 10) Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:36 am
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Jeffrey MacHott wrote in message ...
>Willowhugger wrote:
>> The Honor of the Queen
>>
>> By. Charles Phipps
>>
>
>> It definitely was successful in establishing that Haven had no moral
>> credibility whatsoever by making them ally with the Masadans. It's
>> interesting to note that even the Havenites are repulsed by the
>> Masadans. The acts of brutality that are committed amongst the young
>> women of the Manticore crews are enough to make you want to wish that
>> they would break the Convention on orbital bombardment.
>
>This book made me start liking the Peeps, as we saw that, at least once
>you got low enough down the ranks, they were still good people, and that
>despite any relative deficiencies compared to the Manties, they're still
>leagues above most other militaries you'd come up against. Despite
>having a well-planned mutiny on their hands, they hit the ground running
>and managed to spike the guns (and blow up a boat bay, IIRC) before they
>took their leave of the ship. The Havenite Marines in particular come
>off as highly professional and good at their job (which we only rarely
>ever get to see them do in the series).
>
>> The difference between Manticorean technology and the technology of
>> her enemies first starts making an appearance here for better or
>> worse. I've never been a big fan of the fact that the Manties have
>> this huge tech advantage that allows them to role over the majority of
>> their enemies like Japan vs. Russia. However, David is smart enough
>> to have the Manties slaughtered at first by the Havenites to show that
>> they're not nearly the pushovers that you might initially make out
>> from later nasty victories by the bad guys.
>
>Well, Manties vs. the Masadans is like the US Air Force flying F-16s
>against a third would country flying MiG-17s, it's not even fair.
>During the First Battle of Yeltsin, a single Mantie destroyer put much
>of the Masadan line of battle through a meat grinder before she was
>overwhelmed by their Peep BC (what was it called? Thunder of God?)
>When the other destroyer showed up with a pair of cruisers (and the
>remnants of the Grayson Space Navy), they were able to turn the entire
>Masadan navy into happy meals faster than they could say "Are these
>cooked in Trans fat?"
>
>That said, Manties vs. Havenites tends to be a bit more even, with the
>Manties having the edge one-to-one in similar ships. Against a sole
>Peep BC, with a relatively inexperienced crew, two Manticoran warships
>with well-drilled and led crews were only able to fight her to a
>standstill, and would have suffered outright defeat if White Haven
>hadn't arrived with his squadron of BC's. As it was, all the BC's did
>was goad the Masadan commander into making a severe tactical error in a
>moment of panic, turning away from the BCs and towards a very angry
>Manticoran cruiser skipper who didn't even know what was going on
>anymore, and still had a partially functioning broadside looking for a
>target.


I agree with your comments, except to say that Thunder of God (the ex-Peep
BC)'s
crew wasn't "relatively" inexperienced. It was severely inexperienced.
They barely
knew which buttons did whatever.






>
>Later on, we see the Havenites use clever strategy and tactics (and
>overwhelming numbers) to overcome Manticoran technology on numerous
>occasions, with even Commodore Harrington, the infamously clever Butcher
>of Basilisk, boldly walking into an ambush and being captured.
>
>--
>--Jeffrey MacHott
>
>"Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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deowll

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Since: Aug 13, 2003
Posts: 1477



(Msg. 11) Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:33 am
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"Willowhugger" <charlie_the_cat_pooka DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1172510028.666894.210080@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com...
> The Honor of the Queen
>
> By. Charles Phipps
>
> I must confess this is probably my least favorite of the Honor
> Harrington books and I keep wondering if I shouldn't re-read it in
> light of the revelations that we get about the Graysons because my
> initial read was colored by a fantastic hatred for them. They just
> rubbed me the wrong way in absolutely every single instance that they
> appeared.
>
> I don't think I was fully able to appreciate the deep differences
> between Masada and Grayson on my first read through. My take was that
> both were backwards neo-barbs and really weren't worth either Star
> kingdom or Haven time. David was successful in convincing me that the
> Masadans were MORE repulsive but he didn't do quite as good a job in
> this book to making me like the Graysons.
>
> (Actually, I didn't start to like the Graysons until the introduction
> of Miranda. She oddly remains my favorite Grayson despite her short
> page time)
>
> It definitely was successful in establishing that Haven had no moral
> credibility whatsoever by making them ally with the Masadans. It's
> interesting to note that even the Havenites are repulsed by the
> Masadans. The acts of brutality that are committed amongst the young
> women of the Manticore crews are enough to make you want to wish that
> they would break the Convention on orbital bombardment.
>
> I do have a question though as to whether or not the Masadans really
> did fully intend to annihilate the Graysons if their interior coup
> failed.

Then you simply do not "get" them. From their point of view nothing could
have been more logical.


>I think it would have been interesting to see the Solarian
> League enforce their edict. I always assumed that the punishment for
> using weapons of mass destruction was to have your own destruction
> ensued without mercy or remorse.
>
> Frankly, its a bit difficult to imagine that the Masadans could
> honestly be so utterly backyard in morality yet have such advanced
> technology. On the other hand, religion is a powerful motivating tool
> (though later depictions of Masada seem to indicate that they honestly
> don't have much in the way of religion BUT their misogyny----that
> actually puts them beneath the Taliban as impossible as it may seem)
>
> Honor Harrington is well depicted in this story and I liked the fact
> that she's not yet so invincible or beloved that she's immune to
> making mistakes or possesses much in the way of defenses to her
> character. Honor has won one combat encounter with the Havenites and
> that makes her notable but doesn't actually mean she's warranted any
> real respect from most people.
>
> I just happen to love Reginald Houseman and somehow I hope he manages
> to become Prime Minister because I believe he's a great deal smarter
> than the majority of people around him. He's a lot more dangerous
> than High Ridge as well despite being an arrogant bureaucrat with
> contempt for the military.
>
> Frankly, I imagine that aside from his suggestion that the Masadans
> can be negotiate with...I imagine he's probably usually very
> successful at what he does. Seriously, stick Houseman in the Talbott
> Cluster and the entire place would have been running smoothly with
> economic alliances for everyone's benefit. He's just in the worst
> situation for a man who doesn't believe in religion over money.
>
> Honor's reaction to the man is based upon the heat of the moment and
> frankly was impolitic. The fellow's fright is tremendous in the
> period but understandable given the circumstances. I wish it had
> manifested itself as some vengeance against her other than
> accidentally getting her a new command in 'Honor Amongst Enemies.'
>
> The difference between Manticorean technology and the technology of
> her enemies first starts making an appearance here for better or
> worse. I've never been a big fan of the fact that the Manties have
> this huge tech advantage that allows them to role over the majority of
> their enemies like Japan vs. Russia. However, David is smart enough
> to have the Manties slaughtered at first by the Havenites to show that
> they're not nearly the pushovers that you might initially make out
> from later nasty victories by the bad guys.
>
> Overall, I still enjoyed this book despite my own lack of sympathy for
> the "good" guys.
>
> 6/10
>
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Willowhugger

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Since: Feb 19, 2007
Posts: 48



(Msg. 12) Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:01 am
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Whether I *get* them or not was simply a question of whether or not
they were just ignorant of the Solarian League destroying them or
whether they were willing to go out in suicidal glory.
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raguleader

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Since: Aug 25, 2004
Posts: 583



(Msg. 13) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:58 am
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Willowhugger wrote:
> Whether I *get* them or not was simply a question of whether or not
> they were just ignorant of the Solarian League destroying them or
> whether they were willing to go out in suicidal glory.

Sorry, get who? There's no quoted text in your reply.

--
--Jeffrey MacHott

"Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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fburton

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Since: Aug 18, 2004
Posts: 411



(Msg. 14) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:58 am
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Jeffrey MacHott wrote in message ...
>Willowhugger wrote:
>> Whether I *get* them or not was simply a question of whether or not
>> they were just ignorant of the Solarian League destroying them or
>> whether they were willing to go out in suicidal glory.
>
>Sorry, get who? There's no quoted text in your reply.
>
The Masadans.
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deowll

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Since: Aug 13, 2003
Posts: 1477



(Msg. 15) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:58 am
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"Jeffrey MacHott" <Raguleader.RemoveThis@netzero.net> wrote in message
news:MqqFh.47380$ff2.31338@fe02.news.easynews.com...
> Willowhugger wrote:
>> Whether I *get* them or not was simply a question of whether or not
>> they were just ignorant of the Solarian League destroying them or
>> whether they were willing to go out in suicidal glory.
>
> Sorry, get who? There's no quoted text in your reply.
>

The book clearly states they understood what would happen if they violated
the edict.


> --
> --Jeffrey MacHott
>
> "Sola bona lingua est mortua lingua"
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