Welcome to BookBoardz.com!
FAQFAQ      ProfileProfile    Private MessagesPrivate Messages   Log inLog in

The Function of Literature

 
   Book Forums (Home) -> Arts RSS
Next:  Just had to share...  
Author Message
jeffrubard2

External


Since: May 12, 2004
Posts: 7



(Msg. 1) Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2004 11:40 pm
Post subject: The Function of Literature
Archived from groups: rec>arts>books (more info?)

The function of literature, the basis of its cultivation by humanity, is
clearly not solely a matter of enjoyment. Although it is possible to
read a work of literature with profound pleasure, from whence the
pleasure derives and its ultimate effect of it upon the formation of an
aesthetic deserve a thorough examination. But the fundamental question
of literature is perhaps that of poetic form: what is it for a work to
have poetic form? What differentiates a piece of writing with notable
poetic form from ordinary discourse, and why do we prefer one to the
other? The answers to such questions clearly derive from the character
of literature as a whole, the reasons we turn to it for edification and
relief; so perhaps a brief examination of literature's formal status can
shed light upon the question of poetic form in particular.

Literature is coextensive with the real. It is not so much that we ought
to like it, as that we should like some parts of it given our worldly
dealings: if a particular genre suits our fancy, it is hardly impossible
that we maintain some practical connection to the subject-matter, if
only from a comfortable distance. Broadly speaking, we like literature
because we find language to be the omnipresent mediator and divider of
our affairs it obviously is, and literature counts as something like
"sympathetic magic" with respect to the felicity of our utterances and
our place within the whole of speech, a safeguard against the inability
of a form of words to have their appropriate purchase upon us. It is
true that language and literature are not so easily divided: separating
a classical work from the commonplace analogies made to it is hard
going, and this is the point.

So it would not be beside the point to specify poetic form as an attempt
to imbue a going form of words with a certain character, a stipulation
of a discourse's purchase within the social totality: this is exactly
what the aim of all language is, and literature in this estimation turns
out to be the conscious cultivation of the arts of language, a notable
attempt to impress upon the reading public a certain sensibility in
practical dealings. The edification experienced by the reader of
literature is coextensive with the practical education life in general,
and to cultivate a taste for the existent is by no means a foolish
endeavor but rather a specifically literary activity. With this in mind,
it seems that the formal analysis of literature is in fact an extremely
pragmatic discipline permitting of many applications to everyday cares:
but perhaps we can say that here we have a motive for plot, and leave it
at that.

--
Jeff Rubard
http://opensentence.tripod.com/
Essays on theory, culture, and politics

 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
rlaw1979

External


Since: Feb 05, 2004
Posts: 5



(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

The function of literature is actually to heighten our own understanding of
what it is to be human and to record it for future generations. Any kind of
book can be a great piece of literature.
What I disagree with is the Newsnight Review version of literature and the
presecribed literature of education. Books that are put forward as great works
are often no and I as for Newsnight Review, they lacked the intelligence to
read a Patrick O'Brian novel and far less to understand it. Truly great
literature creates a world within th confines of book as if another reality
lies within the words.
As for poetic writing I think that poetry is better utilised as one of ideas
and synthesis of presentation rather than the cheap showiness of people pushing
poetic works in an attempt to appear more intelligent than they truly are.

 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
jeffrubard2

External


Since: May 12, 2004
Posts: 7



(Msg. 3) Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 3:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

RLAW1979 wrote:
 > The function of literature is actually to heighten our own understanding of
 > what it is to be human and to record it for future generations. Any kind of
 > book can be a great piece of literature.

Yes, but how do we recognize literature *as* literature, and not another
thing? Aren't there some commonalities between literary works which are
not of the order of merit?

 > What I disagree with is the Newsnight Review version of literature and the
 > presecribed literature of education. Books that are put forward as great works
 > are often no and I as for Newsnight Review, they lacked the intelligence to
 > read a Patrick O'Brian novel and far less to understand it. Truly great
 > literature creates a world within th confines of book as if another reality
 > lies within the words.

Agreed, but for this purpose it is necessary to have a standard which
deals with what makes literary works more appealing than laundry lists.
It seems to me that the idea of "another reality", common as it may be,
is in fact a clue as to what a work of literature is: something very
much like the real thing, so like it as to have an appeal which is not
derivative but rather interrelated with it.

 > As for poetic writing I think that poetry is better utilised as one of ideas
 > and synthesis of presentation rather than the cheap showiness of people pushing
 > poetic works in an attempt to appear more intelligent than they truly are.
 >
 >

I was referring to poetic form as a general characteristic of literary
language, not poetry specifically. But don't you think that people
pushing poetic works in an attempt to appear more intelligent than they
are, however apt to fail this might be, are engaging in a literary
practice? Are we merely to grade works, or to employ literary methods in
life, for example writing after the style of a model?

--
Jeff Rubard
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://opensentence.tripod.com/" target="_blank">http://opensentence.tripod.com/</a>
Essays on theory, culture, and politics<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
delatane

External


Since: Mar 15, 2004
Posts: 37



(Msg. 4) Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

The function of literature is to keep intelligent humanists occupied
yammering about books while the other bastards loot the safe.
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
adda1234

External


Since: May 04, 2004
Posts: 135



(Msg. 5) Posted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:09 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Jeff Rubard <jeffrubard DeleteThis @online.ie> wrote in message news:<WIdmd.250$Tq6.243@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>...
 > The function of literature, the basis of its cultivation by humanity, is
 > clearly not solely a matter of enjoyment.

It is just another matter of common interest, dictated by the leaders
of society.

 > Although it is possible to
 > read a work of literature with profound pleasure, from whence the
 > pleasure derives and its ultimate effect of it upon the formation of an
 > aesthetic deserve a thorough examination.

Maybe, but few bother to analyse so much.

 > But the fundamental question
 > of literature is perhaps that of poetic form: what is it for a work to
 > have poetic form?

It should be easily memorised; and so, passed down the ages. This
goes for Sanskrit scriptural literature, if nothing else. The whole
of it can be sung or at least chanted.

 > What differentiates a piece of writing with notable
 > poetic form from ordinary discourse, and why do we prefer one to the
 > other?

You want to remember one, and not the other. For whatever reason.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
delcolja

External


Since: Mar 15, 2004
Posts: 76



(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:36 am
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

delatane.DeleteThis@yahoo.com (delatane) wrote in message news:<5a8d89ad.0411161840.3a56bc82.DeleteThis@posting.google.com>...
 > The function of literature is to keep intelligent humanists occupied
 > yammering about books....

There's question begging for you.


while the other bastards loot the safe.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
ofurorhortensi

External


Since: Nov 04, 2004
Posts: 20



(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Rubard opined:

 >The function of literature, the basis of its cultivation by humanity, is
clearly not solely a matter of enjoyment.

I abjure this Roundhead hooey, and all those who find it necessary to seek to
redeem art by freighting it with trite notions of utility. Pfui. Pfui. Pfui.

Phuror<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
herothatdied

External


Since: Apr 26, 2004
Posts: 163



(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"J. Del Col" <delcolja.RemoveThis@mail.ab.edu> wrote in message
news:c0577cc.0411170536.5beaab71@posting.google.com...
 > delatane.RemoveThis@yahoo.com (delatane) wrote in message
 > news:<5a8d89ad.0411161840.3a56bc82.RemoveThis@posting.google.com>...
  >> The function of literature is to keep intelligent humanists occupied
  >> yammering about books....
 >
 > There's question begging for you.
 >

  >> while the other bastards loot the safe

I was about to ask "then what is the function of literary criticism?" I keep
looking for practical applications: milk production soars when cows are
lectured on the ambivalent feminism in the works of Margaret Oliphant;
inscrutable murders finally solved by separating the proairetic from the
hermeneutic throughlines in the theories of the case; cold-fusion possible,
if only you understand that Hydrogen isn't just Hydrogen, it's a metonym
for... something. That sort of thing. - htd<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
alibrown18

External


Since: Nov 18, 2004
Posts: 1



(Msg. 9) Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:49 am
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Actually, I think now is the point at which the function of literature
(and literary criticism) is starting to be seen in terms which focus
less on aesthetic and more on practical qualities.

In 1997 physicist Alan Sokal published an article in the cultural
journal Social Text, edited by Stanley Fish, essentially trying to
demonstrate that literary criticism had recruited scientific terms and
scattered them carelessly in an attempt to sound good and to
legitimate its enterprise as being ‘practical'.

This re-ignited the ‘Two Cultures' debate, with some in the arts camp
using evolutionary theories to argue that one of the reasons quantum
physics may be so difficult to comprehend is that it plays no part in
our evolution, therefore we are for the most part neurologically not
equipped to deal with it; conversely, the history of literature
(whether oral or written) is probably as long as the era of man, and
therefore it must have some evolutionary impact, perhaps re-enforcing
group bonds or raising man's consciousness of his own consciousness
which, Antonio Damasio has argued, is what distinguishes us from
animals.

Aside from a lot of hot air, the outcome of this debate seems to be
that, in support of Jeff's initial argument that "The function of
literature, the basis of its cultivation by humanity, is clearly not
solely a matter of enjoyment.", having some loosely ‘biological'
importance which has not yet been properly explored. Secondarily, both
camps have been forced to acknowledge the stilted impressions they
still have of each other, forty years after Snow and Leavis's
celebrity deathmatch on the issue. But, unlike then, this time the
debate also points to a way the two may be partially reconciled.

Firstly as science gets more and more deeply involved in complex
theoretical processes, involving space atoms and quarks which no
casual bystander can witness, it gets more and more detached from
having a real practical value; likewise any technological developments
which do result from scientific enterprise tend to be massively
complex: who knows how their microwave works? As this happens, science
increasingly finds itself having to employ what would, out of context,
be regarded otherwise as ‘cultural' or ‘aesthetic' forms in order to
justify its enterprise. Hence the growth in publishing ‘popular
science', ‘science fiction', the history of science; hence the fact
that many physics departments now employ public education or liaison
officers to mediate its findings to the public in exciting ways; hence
the desire to reconnect the public to science by offering them ways to
get involved in projects through distributed computing. Our awareness
that science has an artistic dimension is raised every time we witness
a fractal image, or a false colour impression (scientists can choose
what colour filters to put on their telescopes) of the crab nebula.

Moving in the opposite direction, literary criticism has had to get
involved with science. As Sokal pointed out, literary criticism does
use many of the discourses of science, although probably applies them
in more considered ways than he suggested. Further, one of the current
developments in neuroscience is the study of consciousness which was,
oddly, still a fairly taboo subject for serious scientists until a few
years ago, and a topic partly elevated to the mainstream by literature
(note Golding's Inheritors, for example). Literary criticism, which is
(if I read it correctly Jeff's argument extends to this) essentially
the study of the ‘literariness' of a piece of work i.e. what makes Poe
literature but a car manual not literary, can offer a way into
consciousness. If the same piece of language (i.e. a single piece of
data) is interpreted in different ways as being poetic or not poetic
(i.e. gives different responses under different conditions, a kind of
quasi-empirical method), then uncovering the reasons for this through
a variety of critical approaches may also help to answer the question
of perception i.e. what it is to be me. So Marxist criticism can
illustrate the underlying ideologies with which we come to a piece of
text (or as Jeff rightly says, "a discourse's purchase within the
social totality"), and therefore to what extent consciousness is
socially (pre-)constructed; feminist or post-colonial criticism
invites us to project ourselves imaginatively into seeing the same
work from alternative viewpoints; psychoanalytic criticism, when it
can get away from the back-passages to which it has been consigned in
recent years, suggests the way the sub-conscious may be accessed by
the process of writing. This is not to suggest that the problem of
consciousness can ever be solved by literary criticism, or indeed any
aesthetic criticism; but then scientists have admitted that it can
never be solved by science either. Some conjunction between the two,
in ways not yet fully explored, seems the likely mediating solution.

I may be yammering about books, but arguably that's closer to home,
closer to mind, than staggering about with galaxies, quarks and
super-computers.

Ishmael
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.thepequod.org.uk" target="_blank">http://www.thepequod.org.uk</a>

"herothatdied" <herothatdied DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<66Nmd.6631$GV5.1619@trnddc04>...
 > "J. Del Col" <delcolja DeleteThis @mail.ab.edu> wrote in message
 > news:c0577cc.0411170536.5beaab71@posting.google.com...
  > > delatane DeleteThis @yahoo.com (delatane) wrote in message
  > > news:<5a8d89ad.0411161840.3a56bc82 DeleteThis @posting.google.com>...
   > >> The function of literature is to keep intelligent humanists occupied
   > >> yammering about books....
  > >
  > > There's question begging for you.
  > >
 >
   > >> while the other bastards loot the safe
 >
 > I was about to ask "then what is the function of literary criticism?" I keep
 > looking for practical applications: milk production soars when cows are
 > lectured on the ambivalent feminism in the works of Margaret Oliphant;
 > inscrutable murders finally solved by separating the proairetic from the
 > hermeneutic throughlines in the theories of the case; cold-fusion possible,
 > if only you understand that Hydrogen isn't just Hydrogen, it's a metonym
 > for... something. That sort of thing. - htd<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
adda1234

External


Since: May 04, 2004
Posts: 135



(Msg. 10) Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:41 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

alibrown18.DeleteThis@hotmail.com (A Brown) wrote in message news:<eb1c6fd6.0411180049.5d42e21.DeleteThis@posting.google.com>...
 > Actually, I think now is the point at which the function of literature
 > (and literary criticism) is starting to be seen in terms which focus
 > less on aesthetic and more on practical qualities.

In which case it is words not literature but user manuals.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
jeffrubard2

External


Since: May 12, 2004
Posts: 7



(Msg. 11) Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 5:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

A Brown wrote:
 > Actually, I think now is the point at which the function of literature
 > (and literary criticism) is starting to be seen in terms which focus
 > less on aesthetic and more on practical qualities.

It certainly is forward-looking, given the limited purchase of "cultural
studies" on the cultural present: many promising approaches to providing
criticism with the necessary grip on the republic of letters have been
well-nigh devastated by recent developments in science and society, to
the point that invoking its authority is grounds for a charge of
anything from mental incompetence to being preoccupied with
*Realpolitik*. It needn't be this way, and a refocusing of criticism on
the topics covered by moral philosophy would be one way to avoid charges
of the social whole's irrelevancy.

[Comments about Sokal...]

 >
 > Aside from a lot of hot air, the outcome of this debate seems to be
 > that, in support of Jeff's initial argument that "The function of
 > literature, the basis of its cultivation by humanity, is clearly not
 > solely a matter of enjoyment.", having some loosely ‘biological'
 > importance which has not yet been properly explored. Secondarily, both
 > camps have been forced to acknowledge the stilted impressions they
 > still have of each other, forty years after Snow and Leavis's
 > celebrity deathmatch on the issue. But, unlike then, this time the
 > debate also points to a way the two may be partially reconciled.

There's no need to invoke the hard sciences in favor of an importance of
literature for life: in fact, its distinguishing characteristic seems to
be that it simply "goes well" with practical activity. I am suggesting
(in something of a Kantian spirit) that the reason has to do with
literary language's closely approximating the pith of ordinary language.
But this would be compatible with a cognitive science story about why
the mind/brain finds narrative appealing.

[Scientific language...]

 >
 > Moving in the opposite direction, literary criticism has had to get
 > involved with science. As Sokal pointed out, literary criticism does
 > use many of the discourses of science, although probably applies them
 > in more considered ways than he suggested. Further, one of the current
 > developments in neuroscience is the study of consciousness which was,
 > oddly, still a fairly taboo subject for serious scientists until a few
 > years ago, and a topic partly elevated to the mainstream by literature
 > (note Golding's Inheritors, for example). Literary criticism, which is
 > (if I read it correctly Jeff's argument extends to this) essentially
 > the study of the ‘literariness' of a piece of work i.e. what makes Poe
 > literature but a car manual not literary, can offer a way into
 > consciousness. If the same piece of language (i.e. a single piece of
 > data) is interpreted in different ways as being poetic or not poetic
 > (i.e. gives different responses under different conditions, a kind of
 > quasi-empirical method), then uncovering the reasons for this through
 > a variety of critical approaches may also help to answer the question
 > of perception i.e. what it is to be me. So Marxist criticism can
 > illustrate the underlying ideologies with which we come to a piece of
 > text (or as Jeff rightly says, "a discourse's purchase within the
 > social totality"), and therefore to what extent consciousness is
 > socially (pre-)constructed; feminist or post-colonial criticism
 > invites us to project ourselves imaginatively into seeing the same
 > work from alternative viewpoints; psychoanalytic criticism, when it
 > can get away from the back-passages to which it has been consigned in
 > recent years, suggests the way the sub-conscious may be accessed by
 > the process of writing. This is not to suggest that the problem of
 > consciousness can ever be solved by literary criticism, or indeed any
 > aesthetic criticism; but then scientists have admitted that it can
 > never be solved by science either. Some conjunction between the two,
 > in ways not yet fully explored, seems the likely mediating solution.

To return to the initial premise of your argument, a contemporary
"practical criticism" need not consider the "science wars" as a topic
requiring the positioning of criticism on either side: criticism remains
above the fray, in that its subject-matter contains material (the doings
of ordinary life) excepted from science by scientists. In fact, one
could argue that it is precisely criticism's job to provide a
"sideways-on" view of the world, and that science is no exception on
account of, in another Kantian flourish, being "not only privileged but
pursued". Whether scientists have anything further to say, once their
own practices have been "naturalized" as part of societal activity, is
an open question provided that the importance of the "insider
perspective" is allowed to run its full extent: a literary study of
science without scientists would, after all, be lacking something.

 > I may be yammering about books, but arguably that's closer to home,
 > closer to mind, than staggering about with galaxies, quarks and
 > super-computers.

Thank you for your insightful comments.

 > Ishmael
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.thepequod.org.uk</font" target="_blank">http://www.thepequod.org.uk</font</a>>

--
Jeff Rubard
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://opensentence.tripod.com/" target="_blank">http://opensentence.tripod.com/</a>
Essays on theory, culture, and politics<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
don_tuite1

External


Since: May 26, 2004
Posts: 131



(Msg. 12) Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 8:40 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 18:52:50 GMT, "herothatdied"
<herothatdied RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:


 >
 >I was about to ask "then what is the function of literary criticism?"

Wouldn't that be something like holding a mirror up to a mirror?

Don<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
miniter

External


Since: Mar 13, 2004
Posts: 659



(Msg. 13) Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 9:27 pm
Post subject: Re: The Function of Literature [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

OFurorHortensis wrote:
 > Rubard opined:
 >
 >
  >>The function of literature, the basis of its cultivation by humanity, is
 >
 > clearly not solely a matter of enjoyment.
 >
 > I abjure this Roundhead hooey, and all those who find it necessary to seek to
 > redeem art by freighting it with trite notions of utility. Pfui. Pfui. Pfui.
 >
 > Phuror


Hooray! To me the "function" of literature and art is simply to make you feel
and think.

Though re-reading what I just wrote makes me feel uneasily like one of Socrates'
partners in dialogue. I am just waiting for the devastating question to come
along such as:

Socrates: My dear friend, do you think that art should make one feel any
feeling at all or should it be a noble feeling?

To which I would answer:

FAM: In my humble opinion, Socrates, the ability of art to move one to any
feeling is its unique characteristic. It does not matter whether the feeling is
anger or joy. For, indeed, Socrates, at our own Festival of Dionysus each year
do we not begin with a tragedy, then present a comedy before the second tragedy
of the day, then a second comedy before the final tragedy of the day? So do we
not commend the playwright who is capable of moving the audience through a wide
range of emotion and thought?


Francis A. Miniter<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The Function of Literature 
Back to top
Login to vote
Display posts from previous:   
Related Topics:
The function of aristocrats - David <thedavid@shell.rawbw.com> wrote in message news:<Pine.LNX.4.58.0502080128110.8133@troll.weezl.org>... <font color=purple> ;> On Sun, 6 Feb 2005, Noel Smith wrote:</font> <font color=purple> ;> [....

Literature before 1500? - A few years ago my reading list was predominantly bestsellers from the past 10 years. In the last couple years I've been stretching back a hundred years or so. I would now like to go back to the dawn of literature and read my way forward. I don't..

Quotations From Literature - All, I wanted to let you know about LitQuotes, the site devoted to quotes from literature. The quote collection is now over 1,200 and growing every month! Visit http://www.litquotes.com to enjoy: * Daily quotes * Quotes by topic * Quotes by autho...

More immoral literature - Tonight Girl with a Pearl Earring gets banned from my shelf. Five pages into it and we already have a married man with a pregnant wife leering at his new servant girl and making his spouse jealous and the girl uncomfortable. Forget it. arewhanariki

copyright and literature? - suppose a filmmaker wanted to make a film based on the novel of jane austen or franz kafka. does he have to pay someone for the rights? when do copyrights run out?
   Book Forums (Home) -> Arts All times are: Pacific Time (US & Canada) (change)
Page 1 of 1

 
You can post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



[ Contact us | Terms of Service/Privacy Policy ]