Messiah Complex ending [spoilers]

On 19 Feb 2008 03:11:42 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy DeleteThis @gmail.com>
wrote:

>mimf <mimf DeleteThis @nospam.com> wrote in
>news:pan.2008.02.19.01.24.10.57587@nospam.com:
>
>>> I'd say it was pretty damn effective, considering that most people
>>> have been discussing it around the Net since before the book
>>> officially went on sale. It was meant to get people talking about
>>> what happened to the body, and it sure as hell worked. Unfortunately,
>>> many people guessed too quickly (and correctly) about what happened.
>>
>> So what did happen?
>
>*I* don't know except to say that he's definitely going to be featured
>in the pages of X-Men: Legacy. How he gets there is another story.
>Like others, I had no idea his body was even missing at the end of
>Messiah Complex.

Yeah, I missed that part too...I don't know what the deal is with
X-Men Legacy but I have to say have very little interest in a series
that follows Xavier...did they learn nothing from that lame Excalibur
series?
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 22:13:16 -0600, grinningdemon wrote:

> On 19 Feb 2008 03:11:42 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>mimf <mimf RemoveThis @nospam.com> wrote in
>>news:pan.2008.02.19.01.24.10.57587@nospam.com:
>>
>>>> I'd say it was pretty damn effective, considering that most people
>>>> have been discussing it around the Net since before the book
>>>> officially went on sale. It was meant to get people talking about what
>>>> happened to the body, and it sure as hell worked. Unfortunately, many
>>>> people guessed too quickly (and correctly) about what happened.
>>>
>>> So what did happen?
>>
>>*I* don't know except to say that he's definitely going to be featured in
>>the pages of X-Men: Legacy. How he gets there is another story. Like
>>others, I had no idea his body was even missing at the end of Messiah
>>Complex.
>
> Yeah, I missed that part too...I don't know what the deal is with X-Men
> Legacy but I have to say have very little interest in a series that
> follows Xavier...did they learn nothing from that lame Excalibur series?

I liked the premise for that series. I just wish it had gone somewhere
instead of dawdling around until it was thrown away on House of M. I still
have no idea why it was named Excalibur instead of Genosha or something
actually related to what it was about.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

mimf wrote:
> grinningdemon wrote:
>> Dan McEwen wrote:
>>> mimf wrote:
>>>>> I'd say it was pretty damn effective, considering that most
>>>>> people have been discussing it around the Net since before the
>>>>> book officially went on sale. It was meant to get people
>>>>> talking about what happened to the body, and it sure as hell
>>>>> worked. Unfortunately, many people guessed too quickly (and
>>>>> correctly) about what happened.
>
>>>> So what did happen?
>
>>> *I* don't know except to say that he's definitely going to be
>>> featured in the pages of X-Men: Legacy. How he gets there is
>>> another story. Like others, I had no idea his body was even
>>> missing at the end of Messiah Complex.
>
>> Yeah, I missed that part too...I don't know what the deal is with
>> X-Men Legacy but I have to say have very little interest in a
>> series that follows Xavier...did they learn nothing from that
>> lame Excalibur series?
>
> I liked the premise for that series. I just wish it had gone
> somewhere instead of dawdling around until it was thrown away on
> House of M. I still have no idea why it was named Excalibur
> instead of Genosha or something actually related to what it was
> about.

According to Carey, LEGACY is going to be extremely relevant to the
present and future of the books. It's not going to be Xavier off by
himself.

I kinda spoiled part of how Xavier gets out of this mess, but not all
of it. Carey already has spoiled the rest in interviews.

Basically, the set up is thus...

The Acolyes abscond with his body, taking him to Our Lord Magneto.
Exodus is able to use his powers to bring him back from the brink of
death, but something goes awry... pieces of Xavier's psyche get split
amongst like 40 other people. He needs to go rediscover himself
through these other people as he reimagines his dream.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 01:31:22 -0800 (PST), The Black Guardian
<blakgard RemoveThis @aol.com> wrote:

>mimf wrote:
>> grinningdemon wrote:
>>> Dan McEwen wrote:
>>>> mimf wrote:
>>>>>> I'd say it was pretty damn effective, considering that most
>>>>>> people have been discussing it around the Net since before the
>>>>>> book officially went on sale. It was meant to get people
>>>>>> talking about what happened to the body, and it sure as hell
>>>>>> worked. Unfortunately, many people guessed too quickly (and
>>>>>> correctly) about what happened.
>>
>>>>> So what did happen?
>>
>>>> *I* don't know except to say that he's definitely going to be
>>>> featured in the pages of X-Men: Legacy. How he gets there is
>>>> another story. Like others, I had no idea his body was even
>>>> missing at the end of Messiah Complex.
>>
>>> Yeah, I missed that part too...I don't know what the deal is with
>>> X-Men Legacy but I have to say have very little interest in a
>>> series that follows Xavier...did they learn nothing from that
>>> lame Excalibur series?
>>
>> I liked the premise for that series. I just wish it had gone
>> somewhere instead of dawdling around until it was thrown away on
>> House of M. I still have no idea why it was named Excalibur
>> instead of Genosha or something actually related to what it was
>> about.
>
>According to Carey, LEGACY is going to be extremely relevant to the
>present and future of the books. It's not going to be Xavier off by
>himself.
>
>I kinda spoiled part of how Xavier gets out of this mess, but not all
>of it. Carey already has spoiled the rest in interviews.
>
>Basically, the set up is thus...
>
>The Acolyes abscond with his body, taking him to Our Lord Magneto.
>Exodus is able to use his powers to bring him back from the brink of
>death, but something goes awry... pieces of Xavier's psyche get split
>amongst like 40 other people. He needs to go rediscover himself
>through these other people as he reimagines his dream.

I'll pass...this can only end one way...with Prof. X taking over the
X-Men again...which is a big step backwards and an even bigger
mistake...why, oh why, won't they just let him die?
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

grinningdemon wrote:
> The Black Guardian wrote:
>> mimf wrote:
>>> grinningdemon wrote:
>>>> Dan McEwen wrote:
>>>>> mimf wrote:
>>>>>>> I'd say it was pretty damn effective, considering that most
>>>>>>> people have been discussing it around the Net since before
>>>>>>> the book officially went on sale. It was meant to get people
>>>>>>> talking about what happened to the body, and it sure as hell
>>>>>>> worked. Unfortunately, many people guessed too quickly (and
>>>>>>> correctly) about what happened.
>
>>>>>> So what did happen?
>
>>>>> *I* don't know except to say that he's definitely going to be
>>>>> featured in the pages of X-Men: Legacy. How he gets there is
>>>>> another story. Like others, I had no idea his body was even
>>>>> missing at the end of Messiah Complex.
>
>>>> Yeah, I missed that part too...I don't know what the deal is
>>>> with X-Men Legacy but I have to say have very little interest
>>>> in a series that follows Xavier...did they learn nothing from
>>>> that lame Excalibur series?
>
>>> I liked the premise for that series. I just wish it had gone
>>> somewhere instead of dawdling around until it was thrown away on
>>> House of M. I still have no idea why it was named Excalibur
>>> instead of Genosha or something actually related to what it was
>>> about.
>
>> According to Carey, LEGACY is going to be extremely relevant to
>> the present and future of the books. It's not going to be Xavier
>> off by himself.
>
>> I kinda spoiled part of how Xavier gets out of this mess, but not
>> all of it. Carey already has spoiled the rest in interviews.
>
>> Basically, the set up is thus...
>
>> The Acolyes abscond with his body, taking him to Our Lord Magneto.
>> Exodus is able to use his powers to bring him back from the brink
>> of death, but something goes awry... pieces of Xavier's psyche
>> get split amongst like 40 other people. He needs to go rediscover
>> himself through these other people as he reimagines his dream.
>
> I'll pass...this can only end one way...with Prof. X taking over
> the X-Men again...which is a big step backwards and an even bigger
> mistake...why, oh why, won't they just let him die?

Because all of the younger leaders are proving themselves to be
complete idiots.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 02:09:21 -0800 (PST), The Black Guardian
<blakgard.TakeThisOut@aol.com> wrote:

>grinningdemon wrote:
>> The Black Guardian wrote:
>>> mimf wrote:
>>>> grinningdemon wrote:
>>>>> Dan McEwen wrote:
>>>>>> mimf wrote:
>>>>>>>> I'd say it was pretty damn effective, considering that most
>>>>>>>> people have been discussing it around the Net since before
>>>>>>>> the book officially went on sale. It was meant to get people
>>>>>>>> talking about what happened to the body, and it sure as hell
>>>>>>>> worked. Unfortunately, many people guessed too quickly (and
>>>>>>>> correctly) about what happened.
>>
>>>>>>> So what did happen?
>>
>>>>>> *I* don't know except to say that he's definitely going to be
>>>>>> featured in the pages of X-Men: Legacy. How he gets there is
>>>>>> another story. Like others, I had no idea his body was even
>>>>>> missing at the end of Messiah Complex.
>>
>>>>> Yeah, I missed that part too...I don't know what the deal is
>>>>> with X-Men Legacy but I have to say have very little interest
>>>>> in a series that follows Xavier...did they learn nothing from
>>>>> that lame Excalibur series?
>>
>>>> I liked the premise for that series. I just wish it had gone
>>>> somewhere instead of dawdling around until it was thrown away on
>>>> House of M. I still have no idea why it was named Excalibur
>>>> instead of Genosha or something actually related to what it was
>>>> about.
>>
>>> According to Carey, LEGACY is going to be extremely relevant to
>>> the present and future of the books. It's not going to be Xavier
>>> off by himself.
>>
>>> I kinda spoiled part of how Xavier gets out of this mess, but not
>>> all of it. Carey already has spoiled the rest in interviews.
>>
>>> Basically, the set up is thus...
>>
>>> The Acolyes abscond with his body, taking him to Our Lord Magneto.
>>> Exodus is able to use his powers to bring him back from the brink
>>> of death, but something goes awry... pieces of Xavier's psyche
>>> get split amongst like 40 other people. He needs to go rediscover
>>> himself through these other people as he reimagines his dream.
>>
>> I'll pass...this can only end one way...with Prof. X taking over
>> the X-Men again...which is a big step backwards and an even bigger
>> mistake...why, oh why, won't they just let him die?
>
>Because all of the younger leaders are proving themselves to be
>complete idiots.

I really like the way Cyclops is being written lately (aside from
X-Force #1 where he's a total jerk-off)...I think he should have taken
over permanently years ago...to me, once the X-Men came of age, Xavier
was only ever in the way...and the powers that be seemed to agree by
the way they kept shipping him off to space, jail, Genosha, etc...they
just never wanted to make a permanent stance.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

grinningdemon <grinningdemon.TakeThisOut@austin.rr.com> wrote in
news:np4tr3hdbj4kmta629ft2t4456o3vm8dbo@4ax.com:

> I agree with you on everything but this...I like Cable and
> Rachel...don't get me wrong, I'm glad we're past the days when every
> major storyline has to revolve around the Summers/Grey family line but
> I still like those characters...I didn't care for Cable when he was
> originally introduced but I really did come to like him during his
> solo series (especially during Joe Casey's run)...and I'd much rather
> have Rachel with the X-Men than Jean back...for all intents and
> purposes, she IS Jean with less baggage...and, given her history as a
> hound, that's really saying something about how screwed up Jean's
> history is...also, through Rachel, they can occasionally revisit the
> Phoenix without just repeating themselves over and over like they do
> with Jean.

I'm pretty much in agreement with you. Cable was so boring when he was
introduced. That was probably a side effect of being co-created by Rob
Liefeld. Rachel is also great.

On a side note, I recently read the X-Force mini from a couple years
ago. I think it's really funny that the creator of some of the
characters in the book has no idea how to write them. Well, it would be
funny if reading the book wasn't like watching a car wreck.
Fortunately, the books weren't mine so I didn't have to pay for them.

> Having said this, I don't think we need any more little Summers
> running around...blonde, redhead, or otherwise...and ABSOLUTELY NO
> MORE CLONES.

Total agreement. And yet...I want Scott and Emma to have kids at some
point. They don't have to get married, but they should have a family.
However, that would be years down the road, and comics don't do time
that way.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

The Black Guardian <blakgard.DeleteThis@aol.com> wrote in
news:7d46b60f-320c-414d-b05f-4aad0a32a52c@m23g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:

> It's really only Uncanny and Astonishing that I find completely dumb,
> as far as X-Books go (well, and Wolverine's eleventy books). Oh, and
> Messiah Complex, I felt, was really lacklustre... and Decimation is
> probably the worst thing that's ever been thought of. Other than that,
> I'm digging the X-Books.

I agree that MC was a little lackluster. Decimination could definitely
have been done with 99+% of the mutant population having been killed but
without the removal of the x-gene. No x-gene means no purpose.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

On 22 Feb 2008 18:13:34 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy RemoveThis @gmail.com>
wrote:

>grinningdemon <grinningdemon RemoveThis @austin.rr.com> wrote in
>news:np4tr3hdbj4kmta629ft2t4456o3vm8dbo@4ax.com:
>
>> I agree with you on everything but this...I like Cable and
>> Rachel...don't get me wrong, I'm glad we're past the days when every
>> major storyline has to revolve around the Summers/Grey family line but
>> I still like those characters...I didn't care for Cable when he was
>> originally introduced but I really did come to like him during his
>> solo series (especially during Joe Casey's run)...and I'd much rather
>> have Rachel with the X-Men than Jean back...for all intents and
>> purposes, she IS Jean with less baggage...and, given her history as a
>> hound, that's really saying something about how screwed up Jean's
>> history is...also, through Rachel, they can occasionally revisit the
>> Phoenix without just repeating themselves over and over like they do
>> with Jean.
>
>I'm pretty much in agreement with you. Cable was so boring when he was
>introduced. That was probably a side effect of being co-created by Rob
>Liefeld.

It usually is.

Rachel is also great.

I just hope they bring her back from space soon...I'm happy to have
Havok and Polaris stay out there leading the Starjammers (as long as
they actually plan to do something with them) but I like Rachel with
the X-Men.

>
>On a side note, I recently read the X-Force mini from a couple years
>ago. I think it's really funny that the creator of some of the
>characters in the book has no idea how to write them. Well, it would be
>funny if reading the book wasn't like watching a car wreck.
>Fortunately, the books weren't mine so I didn't have to pay for them.

I actually picked them up from the quarter bins just for collection
purposes...I feel ashamed...Cable/Deadpool had some great moments
though...I'll miss it.

>
>> Having said this, I don't think we need any more little Summers
>> running around...blonde, redhead, or otherwise...and ABSOLUTELY NO
>> MORE CLONES.
>
>Total agreement. And yet...I want Scott and Emma to have kids at some
>point. They don't have to get married, but they should have a family.
>However, that would be years down the road, and comics don't do time
>that way.

I really can't see Emma with kids of her own...she seemed like a
completely different character in X-Men: The End...a lot like Jean
actually...it was just wrong.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

grinningdemon <grinningdemon DeleteThis @austin.rr.com> wrote in
news:kh6vr315aojasb1dg8rhesp650u3ma3mnc@4ax.com:

> On 22 Feb 2008 18:13:34 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy DeleteThis @gmail.com>
> wrote:

> I just hope they bring her back from space soon...I'm happy to have
> Havok and Polaris stay out there leading the Starjammers (as long as
> they actually plan to do something with them) but I like Rachel with
> the X-Men.

Leading the Starjammers? How about in chains with absolutely no
indication that a follow-up is planned?

>>On a side note, I recently read the X-Force mini from a couple years
>>ago. I think it's really funny that the creator of some of the
>>characters in the book has no idea how to write them. Well, it would
>>be funny if reading the book wasn't like watching a car wreck.
>>Fortunately, the books weren't mine so I didn't have to pay for them.
>
> I actually picked them up from the quarter bins just for collection
> purposes...I feel ashamed...Cable/Deadpool had some great moments
> though...I'll miss it.

Me, too. Sucks that it had to end because of some ultimately lame X-Men
crossover.

>>Total agreement. And yet...I want Scott and Emma to have kids at some
>>point. They don't have to get married, but they should have a family.
>>However, that would be years down the road, and comics don't do time
>>that way.
>
> I really can't see Emma with kids of her own...she seemed like a
> completely different character in X-Men: The End...a lot like Jean
> actually...it was just wrong.

I'm not asking for her to become like however lamely Claremont wrote
her. (OK, Claremont writing something these days and lame seem to go
hand-in-hand, but...) I just see them as a family.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

On 23 Feb 2008 05:37:12 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy RemoveThis @gmail.com>
wrote:

>grinningdemon <grinningdemon RemoveThis @austin.rr.com> wrote in
>news:kh6vr315aojasb1dg8rhesp650u3ma3mnc@4ax.com:
>
>> On 22 Feb 2008 18:13:34 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy RemoveThis @gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>
>> I just hope they bring her back from space soon...I'm happy to have
>> Havok and Polaris stay out there leading the Starjammers (as long as
>> they actually plan to do something with them) but I like Rachel with
>> the X-Men.
>
>Leading the Starjammers? How about in chains with absolutely no
>indication that a follow-up is planned?

Yeah, but they aren't dead...it was left wide open...so I'm going to
assume that, if and when the follow up happens, they'll get away and
go about their business.

>
>>>On a side note, I recently read the X-Force mini from a couple years
>>>ago. I think it's really funny that the creator of some of the
>>>characters in the book has no idea how to write them. Well, it would
>>>be funny if reading the book wasn't like watching a car wreck.
>>>Fortunately, the books weren't mine so I didn't have to pay for them.
>>
>> I actually picked them up from the quarter bins just for collection
>> purposes...I feel ashamed...Cable/Deadpool had some great moments
>> though...I'll miss it.
>
>Me, too. Sucks that it had to end because of some ultimately lame X-Men
>crossover.

I actually liked Messiah Complex quite a bit (though the ending needed
some work)...I really liked the way the writers really worked together
on it and they even built up to it rather than just having it come out
of nowhere...it's the first truly collaborative crossover Marvel has
done in a decade...and I'm reserving judgement as to what happens next
with Cable and Deadpool...the Cable/Deadpool series was fun but those
two together never really made sense...now we can conceivably get the
best of both worlds...Cable can have his own series again and Deadpool
is supposed to be getting one down the line too (I just hope Nicieza
writes it)...hopefully, we're trading one good book for two good
books...though the realist in me doubts it.

>
>>>Total agreement. And yet...I want Scott and Emma to have kids at some
>>>point. They don't have to get married, but they should have a family.
>>>However, that would be years down the road, and comics don't do time
>>>that way.
>>
>> I really can't see Emma with kids of her own...she seemed like a
>> completely different character in X-Men: The End...a lot like Jean
>> actually...it was just wrong.
>
>I'm not asking for her to become like however lamely Claremont wrote
>her. (OK, Claremont writing something these days and lame seem to go
>hand-in-hand, but...) I just see them as a family.

To each his own...I don't.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

grinningdemon <grinningdemon.DeleteThis@austin.rr.com> wrote in
news:n8pvr35d9m9udugfbi7b7uqil9n08addvo@4ax.com:

> On 23 Feb 2008 05:37:12 GMT, Dan McEwen <ferroSPAMboy.DeleteThis@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>Me, too. Sucks that it had to end because of some ultimately lame
>>X-Men crossover.
>
> I actually liked Messiah Complex quite a bit (though the ending needed
> some work)...I really liked the way the writers really worked together
> on it and they even built up to it rather than just having it come out
> of nowhere...it's the first truly collaborative crossover Marvel has
> done in a decade

It failed in that it left mutants still a dying breed. Actually, it
left us with Cyclops planning to go around killing even more mutants,
just to make things worse.

....and I'm reserving judgement as to what happens next
> with Cable and Deadpool...the Cable/Deadpool series was fun but those
> two together never really made sense

It was explained well enough in the book.

....now we can conceivably get the
> best of both worlds...Cable can have his own series again and Deadpool
> is supposed to be getting one down the line too (I just hope Nicieza
> writes it)...hopefully, we're trading one good book for two good
> books...though the realist in me doubts it.

Daniel Way is writing it, I think. I glanced through an issue of
Wolverine where Deadpool appeared and I thought his portrayal of
Deadpool was terrible. He requires a certain style to work. Several
writers have been able to use him properly but Way doesn't seem to be
one of them. Maybe that'll change when he writes him alone but I have
my doubts.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers] 

grinningdemon <grinningdemon DeleteThis @austin.rr.com> wrote in
news:n8pvr35d9m9udugfbi7b7uqil9n08addvo@4ax.com:

> I actually liked Messiah Complex quite a bit (though the ending needed
> some work)...I really liked the way the writers really worked together
> on it and they even built up to it rather than just having it come out
> of nowhere...it's the first truly collaborative crossover Marvel has
> done in a decade..

It certainly seemed better structured that some of Marvel's other
crossovers.

But the New X-Men's involvement still seemed tacked on. Worse
than X-Factor's involvement no less, and that hinged pretty much
solely on a couple of characters being brought in to check out
alternate future timelines, and sending someone to infiltrate the
Purifiers.

And it still boils down to a bunch of large fight scenes. Made
worse in crossovers, because the final battles generally need to
involve characters from most if not all the crossover books to
"justify" the crossover.


But still, it was better than many of Marvel's recent efforts.
 >> Stay informed about: Messiah Complex ending [spoilers]