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External
Since: May 31, 2004
Posts: 25
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(Msg. 61) Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2005 10:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: rec>arts>comics>marvel>xbooks (more info?)
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Brian Doyle wrote:
> Paul O'Brien wrote:
>
>>In message <115h74f311cm454 DeleteThis @corp.supernews.com>, tphile
>><tphile DeleteThis @cableone.net> writes
>>
>>>They would have a hell of a time trying to fit the Hellfire Club and
>>>the Shiar Imperial Guard Moon battle (two of the things everybody
>>>will want to see) and do it any justice.
>>
>>Even leaving aside the fact that the whole Hellfire Club thing is
>>lifted wholesale from an episode of AVENGERS (the British TV show).
>>The lawyers might not give a toss about an American comic, but a
>>Hollywood movie...?
>
>
> But imagine if they could get the actors the HC were patterned after to play
> the roles!  Okay, Diana Rigg as Emma Frost might be pushing it a bit with
> that costume, but...
>
>
but if anyone could rigg it, Diana could 
iirc it was Diana Rigg that designed the original Queen of Sin costume
in the first place.
but if not, then Famke will do just nicely.
unfortunately, they will probably change that uniform as well.
tphile<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> |
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External
Since: Mar 01, 2005
Posts: 85
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(Msg. 62) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:30 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Aaron Forever wrote:
>
>
> sure, fine, that's great. but there will be more X-Men movies. sure, it
> may be 10 years, with an all new cast, but neither Marvel, nor the studio
> that holds the license is going to be so stupid as to have it just sitting
> there doing nothing, especially considering that licensing is Marvel's
> primary business concern these days.
I never meant to say X-Men 3 would be the last X-Men ever. Only that's
it's the last of this installment, and after this it will likely take a
while. Say like 10 years.
>
><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> |
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External
Since: Mar 01, 2005
Posts: 85
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(Msg. 63) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:33 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul O'Brien wrote:
> In message <115h74f311cm454 DeleteThis @corp.supernews.com>, tphile
> <tphile DeleteThis @cableone.net> writes
>
>> They would have a hell of a time trying to fit the Hellfire Club and
>> the Shiar Imperial Guard Moon battle (two of the things everybody will
>> want to see) and do it any justice.
>
>
> Even leaving aside the fact that the whole Hellfire Club thing is lifted
> wholesale from an episode of AVENGERS (the British TV show). The
> lawyers might not give a toss about an American comic, but a Hollywood
> movie...?
>
There's a real life Hellfire Club in New York City. It's an S&M club.
So it isn't necessarily British. And I think the club as it is in the
X-Men is based on the NYC Hellfre Club that Claremont likely went to.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Mar 01, 2005
Posts: 85
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(Msg. 64) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:35 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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tphile wrote:
> Paul O'Brien wrote:
>
>> In message <115h74f311cm454 RemoveThis @corp.supernews.com>, tphile
>> <tphile RemoveThis @cableone.net> writes
>>
>>> They would have a hell of a time trying to fit the Hellfire Club and
>>> the Shiar Imperial Guard Moon battle (two of the things everybody will
>>> want to see) and do it any justice.
>>
>>
>>
>> Even leaving aside the fact that the whole Hellfire Club thing is
>> lifted wholesale from an episode of AVENGERS (the British TV show).
>> The lawyers might not give a toss about an American comic, but a
>> Hollywood movie...?
>>
>
> true, but since the Hellfire Club is an actual historical organization.
> I expect they can work around it.
> and I could see The Hellfire Club as the organization behind The
> Sentinels and maybe was involved with Project X as well.
>
> but the Imperial Guard was a swipe of DC's LSH, would DC sue
> Marvel?
>
> tphile
It definitely won't matter because I doubt Marvel would use the Imperial
Guard. It doesn't look like they'll be aliens in X-Men 3. And notice
that with the exception of Nightcrawler, all the X-Men look perfectly
human in the movies.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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Since: Jul 02, 2004
Posts: 330
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(Msg. 65) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:36 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Brian Doyle wrote:
> Paul O'Brien wrote:
>>In message <d3bqae$cce$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>, Brian Doyle
>>>As they put it in Animaniacs....
>>I've got to admire the sheer insane hypocrisy of doing a song
>>excoriating Variety magazine for its use of incomprehensible insider
>>references... on ANIMANIACS.
> Animaniacs, mercifully, always saw the insanity inherent in their
> existence...
You guys got Animaniacs in the UK? What channel? I loved it, as I work in
entertainment, but so many folks didn't get it or like it. The kids loved it as
a kids show, but the adults just didn't get the references. 
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk ..."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Mar 01, 2004
Posts: 733
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(Msg. 66) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 2:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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~consul wrote:
> Brian Doyle wrote:
>> Paul O'Brien wrote:
>>> In message <d3bqae$cce$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>, Brian Doyle
>>>> As they put it in Animaniacs....
>>> I've got to admire the sheer insane hypocrisy of doing a song
>>> excoriating Variety magazine for its use of incomprehensible insider
>>> references... on ANIMANIACS.
>> Animaniacs, mercifully, always saw the insanity inherent in their
>> existence...
>
> You guys got Animaniacs in the UK? What channel?
ITV. We also got the excellent "Tiny Toon Adventures", the classic "Pinky
and the Brain" and the unsurpassed insaity of "Freakazoid".
> I loved it, as I
> work in entertainment, but so many folks didn't get it or like it.
> The kids loved it as a kids show, but the adults just didn't get the
> references.
I did! <!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Jan 31, 2004
Posts: 213
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(Msg. 67) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 00:33:11 -0500, Justin Samuels
<viaong1 RemoveThis @bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Paul O'Brien wrote:
>> In message <115h74f311cm454 RemoveThis @corp.supernews.com>, tphile
>> <tphile RemoveThis @cableone.net> writes
>>> They would have a hell of a time trying to fit the Hellfire Club and
>>> the Shiar Imperial Guard Moon battle (two of the things everybody will
>>> want to see) and do it any justice.
>> Even leaving aside the fact that the whole Hellfire Club thing is lifted
>> wholesale from an episode of AVENGERS (the British TV show). The
>> lawyers might not give a toss about an American comic, but a Hollywood
>> movie...?
>There's a real life Hellfire Club in New York City. It's an S&M club.
>So it isn't necessarily British. And I think the club as it is in the
>X-Men is based on the NYC Hellfre Club that Claremont likely went to.
Which wouldn't surprise many here, based on recent Claremont themes
However ... you've been around here long enough surely Justin to know
that the X-men's version of the Hellfire Club came directly from the
Avengers TV show, which itself based it's Hellfire Club on the
real-world 18th C (?) HC?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Feb 28, 2004
Posts: 449
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(Msg. 68) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In message <115jndt7hog7s66.RemoveThis@corp.supernews.com>, tphile
<tphile.RemoveThis@cableone.net> writes
>
>true, but since the Hellfire Club is an actual historical organization.
>I expect they can work around it.
They could, but they'd be better just rewriting the storyline and
skipping the Hellfire Club altogether. As it stands, the Dark Phoenix
Saga has this rather odd structure where the villains provoke Jean into
turning into Dark Phoenix and then... just disappear when the plot is
finished with them, even though the story's still got half its length to
go.
That worked just fine in the comics because people didn't think in such
regimented story arcs in those days, but it reads a bit strangely as a
film story. I imagine the plot will involve some villain corrupting
Jean, trying to manipulate her, and realising too late that she's out of
control.
--
Paul O'Brien
THE X-AXIS - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.thexaxis.com" target="_blank">http://www.thexaxis.com</a>
ARTICLE 10 - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.ninthart.com" target="_blank">http://www.ninthart.com</a>
LIVEJOURNAL - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.livejournal.com/~paulobrien" target="_blank">http://www.livejournal.com/~paulobrien</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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Since: Feb 28, 2004
Posts: 449
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(Msg. 69) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In message <YWn6e.52268$vK6.11084@bignews3.bellsouth.net>, Justin
Samuels <viaong1.DeleteThis@bellsouth.net> writes
>
>There's a real life Hellfire Club in New York City. It's an S&M club.
>So it isn't necessarily British. And I think the club as it is in the
>X-Men is based on the NYC Hellfre Club that Claremont likely went to.
Claremont's always acknowledged that his version of the Hellfire Club is
based on the Avengers episode. It even had a very similar plot, with
the female lead being brainwashed into becoming their Queen.
The original Hellfire Club was a real historical club from the 1700s.
Basically, a gentlemen's brothel.
--
Paul O'Brien
THE X-AXIS - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.thexaxis.com" target="_blank">http://www.thexaxis.com</a>
ARTICLE 10 - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.ninthart.com" target="_blank">http://www.ninthart.com</a>
LIVEJOURNAL - <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.livejournal.com/~paulobrien" target="_blank">http://www.livejournal.com/~paulobrien</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Mar 01, 2004
Posts: 733
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(Msg. 70) Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul O'Brien wrote:
> In message <115jndt7hog7s66 DeleteThis @corp.supernews.com>, tphile
> <tphile DeleteThis @cableone.net> writes
>>
>> true, but since the Hellfire Club is an actual historical
>> organization. I expect they can work around it.
>
> They could, but they'd be better just rewriting the storyline and
> skipping the Hellfire Club altogether.
Shame though it would be to miss out on Famke Jansen in THAT costume, I
agree.
> I imagine the plot will involve some
> villain corrupting Jean, trying to manipulate her, and realising too
> late that she's out of control.
And Magneto as he's depicted in the movie would be the perfect choice, the
idea of him charismatically subverting another of Charles students (after
trying with Rogue and then succeeding with the small fry like Pyro), works
nicely, plus it saves on ANOTHER character having to be introduced.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Mar 01, 2005
Posts: 85
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(Msg. 71) Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:44 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul O'Brien wrote:
> In message <YWn6e.52268$vK6.11084@bignews3.bellsouth.net>, Justin
> Samuels <viaong1 DeleteThis @bellsouth.net> writes
>
>>
>> There's a real life Hellfire Club in New York City. It's an S&M club.
>> So it isn't necessarily British. And I think the club as it is in the
>> X-Men is based on the NYC Hellfre Club that Claremont likely went to.
>
>
> Claremont's always acknowledged that his version of the Hellfire Club is
> based on the Avengers episode. It even had a very similar plot, with
> the female lead being brainwashed into becoming their Queen.
>
> The original Hellfire Club was a real historical club from the 1700s.
> Basically, a gentlemen's brothel.
>
That's just because he didn't want people to know that he is a regular
customer at the NYC Hellfire Club. Which is an S&M brothel.
Claremont has so many S&M themes in his work. It's obvious than he has
a lot of experience with these kinds of things. And that's why
Claremont loves powerful women, because they tie into his fantasies of
dominatrixes.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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External
Since: Aug 12, 2004
Posts: 187
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(Msg. 72) Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2005 4:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Justin Samuels" <viaong1 DeleteThis @bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:58R6e.51740$vL3.6388@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
> Paul O'Brien wrote:
>
> > In message <YWn6e.52268$vK6.11084@bignews3.bellsouth.net>, Justin
> > Samuels <viaong1 DeleteThis @bellsouth.net> writes
> >
> >>
> >> There's a real life Hellfire Club in New York City. It's an S&M club.
> >> So it isn't necessarily British. And I think the club as it is in the
> >> X-Men is based on the NYC Hellfre Club that Claremont likely went to.
> >
> >
> > Claremont's always acknowledged that his version of the Hellfire Club is
> > based on the Avengers episode. It even had a very similar plot, with
> > the female lead being brainwashed into becoming their Queen.
> >
> > The original Hellfire Club was a real historical club from the 1700s.
> > Basically, a gentlemen's brothel.
> >
> That's just because he didn't want people to know that he is a regular
> customer at the NYC Hellfire Club. Which is an S&M brothel.
>
> Claremont has so many S&M themes in his work. It's obvious than he has
> a lot of experience with these kinds of things. And that's why
> Claremont loves powerful women, because they tie into his fantasies of
> dominatrixes.
Oh yes, because the only way that a fictitious female character can be
powerful is if she ties into dominatrix fantasies. And here I just thought
they were realistic....<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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Since: Feb 24, 2005
Posts: 384
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(Msg. 73) Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2005 10:55 pm
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Aaron Forever" <nobody.TakeThisOut@nowhere.com> wrote in
news:7nV6e.13126$8Z6.11924@attbi_s21:
> "Justin Samuels" <viaong1.TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:58R6e.51740$vL3.6388@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>> Claremont has so many S&M themes in his work. It's obvious than he
>> has a lot of experience with these kinds of things. And that's why
>> Claremont loves powerful women, because they tie into his fantasies
>> of dominatrixes.
>
> Oh yes, because the only way that a fictitious female character can be
> powerful is if she ties into dominatrix fantasies. And here I just
> thought they were realistic....
I don't think he's really off-base here. Claremont does like the
leather and extremely strong-willed women. If one or two women were had
these powerful wills, fine, but it's all of them. Plus, they're all
super-geniuses or extremely exceptional at something or other.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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Since: Aug 12, 2004
Posts: 187
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(Msg. 74) Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 6:55 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Dan McEwen" <ferroboy.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:3c3bqfF6mpcv5U11@individual.net...
> "Aaron Forever" <nobody.DeleteThis@nowhere.com> wrote in
> news:7nV6e.13126$8Z6.11924@attbi_s21:
>
> > "Justin Samuels" <viaong1.DeleteThis@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> > news:58R6e.51740$vL3.6388@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>
> >> Claremont has so many S&M themes in his work. It's obvious than he
> >> has a lot of experience with these kinds of things. And that's why
> >> Claremont loves powerful women, because they tie into his fantasies
> >> of dominatrixes.
> >
> > Oh yes, because the only way that a fictitious female character can be
> > powerful is if she ties into dominatrix fantasies. And here I just
> > thought they were realistic....
>
> I don't think he's really off-base here. Claremont does like the
> leather and extremely strong-willed women. If one or two women were had
> these powerful wills, fine, but it's all of them.
Yeah, there's nothing worse than a willful woman. Except several of them.
>Plus, they're all
> super-geniuses or extremely exceptional at something or other.
Um, yes, well these are superhero comic books. That's sort of the point.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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Since: Jul 02, 2004
Posts: 330
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(Msg. 75) Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:24 am
Post subject: Re: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Aaron Forever wrote:
> "Dan McEwen" <ferroboy.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>I don't think he's really off-base here. Claremont does like the
>>leather and extremely strong-willed women. If one or two women were had
>>these powerful wills, fine, but it's all of them.
> Yeah, there's nothing worse than a willful woman. Except several of them.
Dan isn't being sexist here. If we have one Hulk, then it's great. If we have 5,
then it's dumb. If Claremont gave us 5 different types of strong women, it'd be
diversity, not the 5 Hulks.
I chose Hulk as an example because he makes them super strong and super duper
dumb as well.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk ..."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: will the Phoenix force be killed of permanently? |
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