"Second Printing before Publication"

In that case, does it count as a first printing? And then, do they have
3 first printings?


Francis A. Miniter


Alfred Armstrong wrote:

 >on 01 Sep 2004 in rec.collecting.books, Telicalbook chanted thus:
 >
 >
 >
  >>"Second Printing before Publication" -- what does this mean? I'm
  >>looking at Cheever's Falconer, but I have also seen it on other books.
  >>
  >>
 >
 >It means that there was so much interest in the book, with large pre-orders
 >form booksellers, that the initial print run was deemed insufficient, so
 >they printed another lot. Presumably this is considered a marketing point
 >by the publisher, as there's no other reason I can think of that they need
 >to state it.
 >
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: "Second Printing before Publication" 

"Francis A. Miniter" wrote...
 > Alfred Armstrong wrote:
  > > Telicalbook chanted thus:
  > >
   > >>"Second Printing before Publication" -- what does this mean?
  > >
  > >It means that there was so much interest in the book, with large
pre-orders
  > >form booksellers, that the initial print run was deemed insufficient, so
  > >they printed another lot....
 >
 > In that case, does it count as a first printing? And then, do they have
 > 3 first printings?

Nope. A second printing is a second printing...is a later printing.


--
Jon Meyers
(To reply, lose
your way)<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: "Second Printing before Publication" 

Jon Meyers wrote:

 >"Francis A. Miniter" wrote...
 >
 >
  >>Alfred Armstrong wrote:
  >>
  >>
   >>>Telicalbook chanted thus:
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>>"Second Printing before Publication" -- what does this mean?
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>It means that there was so much interest in the book, with large
   >>>
   >>>
 >pre-orders
 >
 >
   >>>form booksellers, that the initial print run was deemed insufficient, so
   >>>they printed another lot....
   >>>
   >>>
  >>In that case, does it count as a first printing? And then, do they have
  >>3 first printings?
  >>
  >>
 >
 >Nope. A second printing is a second printing...is a later printing.
 >
 >
 >

So, if we have a book various copies of which state the following:

a. 1st printing before publication
b . 2nd printing before publication
c. first printing
d . second printing

What is the true order? And which is the real first?


Francis A. Miniter<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: "Second Printing before Publication" 

In article <41361776_3 RemoveThis @news3.prserv.net>, miniter RemoveThis @attglobalZZ.net wrote:

 >
 > So, if we have a book various copies of which state the following:
 >
 > a. 1st printing before publication
 > b . 2nd printing before publication
 > c. first printing
 > d . second printing
 >
 > What is the true order? And which is the real first?
 >
 >
 > Francis A. Miniter


For Knopf, up to the early 1930s, the first edition bore no statement of
edition. None. The second printing would say "Second Printing." But for
some bestsellers, the first edition went largely to reviewers, newspapers,
or advance orders, in which case they would hastily reprint a "1st
Printing Before Publication" which is in reality the second printing of
the first edition. I've seen as many as five printings before publication,
but more commonly by the time the get to the "First Printing" (defined as
the first printing distributed exclusively to the trade) this would
actually be the third printing of the first edition. Copies distributed on
the official release date will state First Printing, but this is not to be
confused with the First Edition, which had no statement of any kind.

About the mid-1930s they switched to stating explicitly "First Edition"
only on actual first printings of the first edition, or First American
Edition if the book appeared first in England, though not many US
publishers cared to make that distinction. Any Knopf statement of a
"printing" is a reprint, even if the statement is "First Printing." It
does seem to me that Knopf intended this to be confusing so that the
average bookshop trade would not feel they had been shipped reprints of
brand new books. Not all publishers distinguished between "Edition" &
"Printing" for fiction, but Knopf always did. It could not be a new
edition unless the text was revised, it was otherwise always a Printing.

These things can't be worked out from logic. Every publisher had their own
methods which transmuted over time. The only way to be certain about these
matters is to have a guide to how to tell each publisher's first editions
with a decade break down. Even then it will not invariably be definitively
knowable for every vintage imprint.

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
Visit the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.paghat.com" target="_blank">http://www.paghat.com</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: "Second Printing before Publication" 

"Francis A. Miniter" wrote...
 > Jon Meyers wrote:
  > >"Francis A. Miniter" wrote...
   > >>Alfred Armstrong wrote:
   > >>>Telicalbook chanted thus:
   > >>>
   > >>>>"Second Printing before Publication" -- what does this mean?
   > >>>>
   > >>>It means that there was so much interest in the book, with large
pre-orders
   > >>> form booksellers, that the initial print run was deemed insufficient,
so
   > >>>they printed another lot....
   > >>>
   > >>In that case, does it count as a first printing? And then, do they have
   > >>3 first printings?
  > >
  > >Nope. A second printing is a second printing...is a later printing.
 >
 > So, if we have a book various copies of which state the following:
 >
 > a. 1st printing before publication
 > b . 2nd printing before publication
 > c. first printing
 > d . second printing
 >
 > What is the true order? And which is the real first?

You'd never see this. The true first printing--which is, of course, always
before publication--would be identified in the normal way. If there were a
"Second printing before publication" (which might also be labelled as "First
and Second Printings before publication"), it would be followed by the third
printing. The only publisher I can bring to mind that uses this form is
Knopf, which uses this system:

1st printing states "First Edition"

2nd printing states "Published [month day, year] / First and Second
Printings before publication [month, year]" OR "Published [month day,
year] / Second printing before publication [month, year]" OR "Published
[month day, year] / Second printing [month, year]" (this last is used
when the 2nd printing comes after publication)

3rd printings would simply add to the above forms the line "Third printing
[month, year]" (And presumably, if there were a third printing before
publication--I think perhaps I've seen one, but I can't recall for sure--it
would follow one of the first two forms above for a second printing.)

After a few reprints, perhaps as few as two or three, the form becomes
"Published [month day, year] / Reprinted [X] times / [X + 2]th printing
[month year]"



--
Jon Meyers
(To reply, lose
your way)<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: "Second Printing before Publication" 

"Francis A. Miniter" <miniter.DeleteThis@attglobalZZ.net> wrote in message
news:41361776_3@news3.prserv.net...
 > Jon Meyers wrote:
 >
  > >"Francis A. Miniter" wrote...
  > >
  > >
   > >>Alfred Armstrong wrote:
   > >>
   > >>
   > >>>Telicalbook chanted thus:
   > >>>
   > >>>
   > >>>
   > >>>>"Second Printing before Publication" -- what does this mean?
   > >>>>
   > >>>>
   > >>>It means that there was so much interest in the book, with large
   > >>>
   > >>>
  > >pre-orders
  > >
  > >
   > >>>form booksellers, that the initial print run was deemed insufficient,
so
   > >>>they printed another lot....
   > >>>
   > >>>
   > >>In that case, does it count as a first printing? And then, do they have
   > >>3 first printings?
   > >>
   > >>
  > >
  > >Nope. A second printing is a second printing...is a later printing.
  > >
  > >
  > >
 >
 > So, if we have a book various copies of which state the following:
 >
 > a. 1st printing before publication
 > b . 2nd printing before publication
 > c. first printing
 > d . second printing
 >
 > What is the true order? And which is the real first?
 >
 >
 > Francis A. Miniter

....

Presumably all 1st printings are 1st printings before publication

Without being merely sophistical you can't have a 1st printing
after publication.

And so the 2nd printing, is a 2nd printing whether it happens
before or after publication. But when it's called for prior to
publication, it makes a good publicity point. And so its explicitly
declared as such.

However where it might become an issue presumably, is where the
2nd printing went on sale, before the 1st printing for some
reason. Although this is stretching it a bit. As under even normal
circumstances large numbers of the 1st printing may be left unsold
in places, when the post-publication 2nd printing goes on sale.


michael adams

....

 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: "Second Printing before Publication"