Religious characters are always bigots in comics

barnett.RemoveThis@shentel.net wrote in
news:1161223264.805099.75000@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

> I'd love to see a converstaion with a religious character in the
> X-books where someone points out that Methuselah lived to 900 and
> other things that are impossible as a pro-mutant arguement.

The difference is (in their minds) that Methueselah's longevity is
attributed to God's will (assuming scholars can even agree that the
stories about his age are meant to be taken literally or just plain
error). Things that happen now are no longer accepted as being related
to God. But this is hardly different than accepting that people spoke
to God and angels in the Bible but assuming anyone who claims to do so
now is just crazy.

--
"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain
occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive." --Thomas Jefferson

"How far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying
to defend from without?" --Dwight D. Eisenhower
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Dan McEwen wrote:
> barnett RemoveThis @shentel.net wrote in
> news:1161223264.805099.75000@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
> > I'd love to see a converstaion with a religious character in the
> > X-books where someone points out that Methuselah lived to 900 and
> > other things that are impossible as a pro-mutant arguement.
>
> The difference is (in their minds) that Methueselah's longevity is
> attributed to God's will (assuming scholars can even agree that the
> stories about his age are meant to be taken literally or just plain
> error). Things that happen now are no longer accepted as being related
> to God. But this is hardly different than accepting that people spoke
> to God and angels in the Bible but assuming anyone who claims to do so
> now is just crazy.

Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods will".
Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If we
can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Ah, but a random genetic quirk trigger some sort of physical alteration
is not something that could be chosen.

JLB


Billy Bissette wrote:
> "masonReloaded" <jonmason1977.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods will".
> > Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If we
> > can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?
>
> Not to get into a religious debate, but that is kind of the concept of
> "free will," that God lets people choose even if they choose something
> against his will.
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Billy Bissette wrote:
> "masonReloaded" <jonmason1977 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in
> news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods will".
> > Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If we
> > can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?
>
> Not to get into a religious debate, but that is kind of the concept of
> "free will," that God lets people choose even if they choose something
> against his will.

Never really understood that: If I say, "You can leave this room or
stay, it's your own free choice", while holding a *gun* to your head
and making it clear that if you *try* to leave, then I'll shoot...Then
am I really giving you "free will"?

Dex
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Billy Bissette wrote:
> barnett.TakeThisOut@shentel.net wrote in
> news:1161306669.174820.105830@f16g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Ah, but a random genetic quirk trigger some sort of physical
> > alteration is not something that could be chosen.
>
> Being born in an area that hasn't yet heard of the "proper" religion
> is also something that couldn't be chosen. But some will argue those
> people were damned because they never magically knew the right religion.

The official answer I've been given is that there is apparently NOwhere
on Earth that Missionaries haven't now gone, so ignorance is no
excuse...

Just sucks to be one of those untold trillions born *before*
Missionaries went everywhere, I guess...>_>

Dex
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

"masonReloaded" <jonmason1977 RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in
news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

> Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods
> will".
> Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If
> we
> can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?

Eh. Free will trumps what God wants. It's just you get punished in the
end - if you believe in that sort of thing, anyway.

--
"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain
occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive." --Thomas Jefferson

"How far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying
to defend from without?" --Dwight D. Eisenhower
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

"masonReloaded" <jonmason1977.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in
news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

> Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods will".
> Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If we
> can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?

Not to get into a religious debate, but that is kind of the concept of
"free will," that God lets people choose even if they choose something
against his will.
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

barnett DeleteThis @shentel.net wrote in
news:1161306669.174820.105830@f16g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:

> Ah, but a random genetic quirk trigger some sort of physical
> alteration is not something that could be chosen.

Being born in an area that hasn't yet heard of the "proper" religion
is also something that couldn't be chosen. But some will argue those
people were damned because they never magically knew the right religion.
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Hand-of-Omega wrote:
> Billy Bissette wrote:
> > "masonReloaded" <jonmason1977.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in
> > news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
> >
> > > Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods will".
> > > Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If we
> > > can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?
> >
> > Not to get into a religious debate, but that is kind of the concept of
> > "free will," that God lets people choose even if they choose something
> > against his will.
>
> Never really understood that: If I say, "You can leave this room or
> stay, it's your own free choice", while holding a *gun* to your head
> and making it clear that if you *try* to leave, then I'll shoot...Then
> am I really giving you "free will"?
>
> Dex

But we only have some basic vague idea of what will trigger the
shooting.

JLB
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

"Hand-of-Omega" <handofomega RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1161318284.902484.309230@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

>
> Billy Bissette wrote:
>> barnett RemoveThis @shentel.net wrote in
>> news:1161306669.174820.105830@f16g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
>>
>> > Ah, but a random genetic quirk trigger some sort of physical
>> > alteration is not something that could be chosen.
>>
>> Being born in an area that hasn't yet heard of the "proper" religion
>> is also something that couldn't be chosen. But some will argue those
>> people were damned because they never magically knew the right religion.
>
> The official answer I've been given is that there is apparently NOwhere
> on Earth that Missionaries haven't now gone, so ignorance is no
> excuse...
>
> Just sucks to be one of those untold trillions born *before*
> Missionaries went everywhere, I guess...>_>

Yes, that was more my point.
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

"Hand-of-Omega" <handofomega.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1161317732.515245.29210@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com:

>
> Billy Bissette wrote:
>> "masonReloaded" <jonmason1977.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>>
>> > Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods
>> > will".
>> > Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt.
>> > If we
>> > can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?
>>
>> Not to get into a religious debate, but that is kind of the concept
>> of
>> "free will," that God lets people choose even if they choose
>> something against his will.
>
> Never really understood that: If I say, "You can leave this room or
> stay, it's your own free choice", while holding a *gun* to your head
> and making it clear that if you *try* to leave, then I'll shoot...Then
> am I really giving you "free will"?

Well, it is still your choice whether or not you want to try to leave.
Maybe you think it is a bluff. Maybe you don't care if it is a bluff,
and would rather be killed than stay in the room. Maybe you'll even
try to jump or trick the guy (which admittedly is a bit difficult if the
guy is God, but people *have* tried the metaphysical equivalent.)

Yes, there is certainly pressure being applied towards a particular
path though. Which is one of my issues with Christianity. There are
various arguments that can be made that continue to support "free will"
though, even when you are basically given an alternative of "damnation
or not." (There are even a few arguments that make it even harder on
the person.)

But, like I said, I'm not trying to participate in a religious debate,
so I won't go into things any further than the above.
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Hand-of-Omega wrote:
> Billy Bissette wrote:
> > barnett.RemoveThis@shentel.net wrote in
> > news:1161306669.174820.105830@f16g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
> >
> > > Ah, but a random genetic quirk trigger some sort of physical
> > > alteration is not something that could be chosen.
> >
> > Being born in an area that hasn't yet heard of the "proper" religion
> > is also something that couldn't be chosen. But some will argue those
> > people were damned because they never magically knew the right religion.
>
> The official answer I've been given is that there is apparently NOwhere
> on Earth that Missionaries haven't now gone, so ignorance is no
> excuse...

Yeah but some people just laugh at missionaries who come and tell then
about Jesus. For a lot of people around the world, their religion
essentially involves honouring their ancestors. Now, some foreigner
tells him they should honour somebody else instead.

It seems to me that the people laughing have a point and that the
missionaries are actually being rude to even suggest that their
religion is better. So who's really being ignorant?

Martin
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics 

Dan McEwen wrote:
> "masonReloaded" <jonmason1977 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in
> news:1161299340.909052.251560@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Agreed - and isnt it wierd that people say "this is against gods
> > will".
> > Isnt he FUCKING GOD. If he didnt want it to happen it wouldnt. If
> > we
> > can go against his will hes not much of a god now is he?
>
> Eh. Free will trumps what God wants. It's just you get punished in the
> end - if you believe in that sort of thing, anyway.

I don't really believe in free will. How many things have we done do
we regret doing? How many things would we really take back if we had
the chance? Ah, but we don't have the chance. Arguably we have free
will if we can see two or more different choices and we choose only one
of these choices. But our choices are all based on our beliefs, our
personal preferences, our sense of morality and our future plans.
These things are predetermined and they make our ultimate choices
inevitable. So we don't really have free will. Like somebody else
pointed out, most of us don't have a choice what religion we belong to:
most of us are brainwashed by our parents who whisper in our ear at an
early age that Mohammed or Jesus is going to save us. Save us from
what? From living a happy life that does not involve terrorising,
persecuting or belittling others apparently.

Martin
 >> Stay informed about: Religious characters are always bigots in comics