Rereading Magician

"Paul Howard" <ppaulshoward.RemoveThis@insightbb.com> wrote
>
> Well, it had been a while between the last time I read the Original
Magician
> and the Expanded Magician, but I did notice the extra scenes in the
expanded
> edition. By the way, I have a "thing" about authors revising their books

Me too, though there's *one* of mine that needs a Director's Cut

> but both _Magician_ and _Prince Of The Blood_ are better in the new
> versions.

There's a new version of Prince? Oh , yeah, I think I saw that mentioned on
here, but I've never seen one in a store...

Must find a copy.

--
Redemption 07 - B5 B7 and Beyond, 23-25 February 2007.
http://www.smof.com/redemption

"A Revolution without dancing isn't worth having." [V]

Book At Bedtime: Magician- expanded edition (Raymond Feist)
http://lonemagpie.livejournal.com
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

"David A McIntee" <david.mcintee DeleteThis @btNOTopenTOSPAMMERSworld.com> wrote in
message news:VrqdnVZraqpkAO3ZnZ2dnUVZ8qCdnZ2d@bt.com...
>
> "Paul Howard" <ppaulshoward DeleteThis @insightbb.com> wrote
>>
>> Well, it had been a while between the last time I read the Original
> Magician
>> and the Expanded Magician, but I did notice the extra scenes in the
> expanded
>> edition. By the way, I have a "thing" about authors revising their books
>
> Me too, though there's *one* of mine that needs a Director's Cut
>
>> but both _Magician_ and _Prince Of The Blood_ are better in the new
>> versions.
>
> There's a new version of Prince? Oh , yeah, I think I saw that mentioned
> on
> here, but I've never seen one in a store...
>
> Must find a copy.
>
> --
> Redemption 07 - B5 B7 and Beyond, 23-25 February 2007.
> http://www.smof.com/redemption
>
> "A Revolution without dancing isn't worth having." [V]
>
> Book At Bedtime: Magician- expanded edition (Raymond Feist)
> http://lonemagpie.livejournal.com
>
>
>
Yes there is and it's now in paperback. Raymond didn't like how it ended
originally (IIRC he was under a deadline) and redid the ending. It's much
better now.

--
*
Paul Howard
*
New e-mail: drakbibliophile at yahoo.com
*
Drak Bibliophile (Bane Of Book Rustlers), Yahoo Id DrakBibliophile
*
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*
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

Paul Howard wrote:
> "David A McIntee" <david.mcintee.DeleteThis@btnotopentospamworld.com> wrote in
> message news:MNednfLbxqlVFvLZnZ2dnUVZ8qqdnZ2d@bt.com...
>> Was in the mood for some big fantasy, and suddenly realised I've
>> never actually read the Magician expanded edition. Oh, I got it when
>> it first came out, but had never got round to reading it, cos
>> usually I stick with matching sets if I'm reading a book series.
>>
>> Mind you, it's been so long since I read the original that I honestly
>> don't expect to notice the differences between the editions...
>>
>> --
>> Redemption 07 - B5 B7 and Beyond, 23-25 February 2007.
>> http://www.smof.com/redemption
>>
>> "A Revolution without dancing isn't worth having." [V]
>>
>> Book At Bedtime: Magician - expanded edition (Raymond Feist)
>>
>> http://lonemagpie.livejournal.com
>>
>>
> Well, it had been a while between the last time I read the Original
> Magician and the Expanded Magician, but I did notice the extra scenes
> in the expanded edition. By the way, I have a "thing" about authors
> revising their books

It's my understanding thaty the original editor did the revising of the
original (or at least "directed" it as Ray didn't have the power back then,
being a fresh, new author just starting out). The "Authors Prefered Edition"
as it's called here (in NZ) is closer to what Ray intended to publish. I
don't see that as a revision, more a correction.

JMO.

> but both _Magician_ and _Prince Of The Blood_
> are better in the new versions.

I haven't read the new version of "Prince", didn't know it existed until
now, thanks for the heads-up.
--
Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

On 22/05/06 at 10:46:36 ~misfit~ somehow managed to type:

<snip>

>
> I haven't read the new version of "Prince", didn't know it existed
> until now, thanks for the heads-up.

Me either. It looks like a trip to my REF friendly bookshop is in
order...

Now all I need is to have the question of who or what the hell is Nakor
answered. I'm pretty damn sure that he is most certainly not as he
describes himself. "For I'm just a man who knows a few tricks" just
doesn't quite cut the mustard... It wouldn't surprise me all that
much if he turned out to be Wodar Hospur... Ahhhh well I s'pose Ray
will reveal all as required...



--

Humbug
Today is Boomtime, the 69th day of Discord in the YOLD 3172
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

Humbug wrote:
> On 22/05/06 at 10:46:36 ~misfit~ somehow managed to type:
>
> <snip>
>
>>
>> I haven't read the new version of "Prince", didn't know it existed
>> until now, thanks for the heads-up.
>
> Me either. It looks like a trip to my REF friendly bookshop is in
> order...
>
> Now all I need is to have the question of who or what the hell is
> Nakor answered. I'm pretty damn sure that he is most certainly not as
> he describes himself. "For I'm just a man who knows a few tricks" just
> doesn't quite cut the mustard... It wouldn't surprise me all that
> much if he turned out to be Wodar Hospur... Ahhhh well I s'pose Ray
> will reveal all as required...

Heh. I think Nakor is just who he says he is*, with maybe a surprise or two
thrown in.

He claims that magic doesn't exist, that he just knows a few tricks. This
would be a reasonable claim for a magician who "developed" his talents in
isolation. Remember, before Pug started his acedemy, magic was an almost
underground thing in Midkemia. The preserve of wise old women, a few lesser
magicians such as <Fantus' former "owner"> Pug's early mentor.

For Nakor to deny magic (and all the negativity that surrounded it for
years) and claim to just know a few tricks is quite reasonable. The truth of
the matter seems to be that he is in fact a very wise, ancient and powerful
largely self-taught magician who brings a unique perspective to other
practitioners of magic.
--
Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

> Humbug wrote:
>> On 22/05/06 at 10:46:36 ~misfit~ somehow managed to type:
>>
<snip>
>...such as <Fantus' former "owner"> Pug's early mentor.

Did you forget the name or deliberately leave it out in an elfish way? =)
--
Joker
"...God hath made me to laugh, so that all that hear will laugh with me."
Gen. 21:6
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

Joker wrote:
>> Humbug wrote:
>>> On 22/05/06 at 10:46:36 ~misfit~ somehow managed to type:
>>>
> <snip>
>> ...such as <Fantus' former "owner"> Pug's early mentor.
>
> Did you forget the name or deliberately leave it out in an elfish
> way? =)

I like that elfish tradition.

Forget? Me? <g> Yeah, probably, (I'm not sure what we're talking about).

Take care,
--
Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

"~misfit~" <misfit61nz RemoveThis @yahooo.co.nz> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:44714f3c@news2.actrix.gen.nz...
> Heh. I think Nakor is just who he says he is*, with maybe a surprise or
two
> thrown in.
>
> He claims that magic doesn't exist, that he just knows a few tricks. This
> would be a reasonable claim for a magician who "developed" his talents in
> isolation. Remember, before Pug started his acedemy, magic was an almost
> underground thing in Midkemia. The preserve of wise old women, a few
lesser
> magicians such as <Fantus' former "owner"> Pug's early mentor.
>
> For Nakor to deny magic (and all the negativity that surrounded it for
> years) and claim to just know a few tricks is quite reasonable. The truth
of
> the matter seems to be that he is in fact a very wise, ancient and
powerful
> largely self-taught magician who brings a unique perspective to other
> practitioners of magic.
> --
> Shaun.
Here we go again

Actually the first question you have to ask is: What is magic in the Feist
universe (Feistverse?) ?

This question alone is more than loaded. In Apprentice the only real "magic"
known to mankind was the lesser path performed by Kuglan (there is the name
you all where looking for). Macros was known to be very powerfull but he was
the only human (is / was he really human?) who could perform anything more
powerfull than that. Elves had a different kind of magic that somehow more
worked in a druidic kind of way.
Then there are the priest of the different gods who also could perform
things that you could define as magic.

To borrow some definitions from D&D (which was the basis for the whole Feist
universe):
Magic is based on spells which have to be learned. It is based on learning
and intelligence.
Druidic Magic is based on the nature and the ability to shape and influence
it.
Cleric Magic is based on faith to the gods and their intervention.

Nakor (I finaly had to come to him, didn't I?) doesn't fit into any of this
category and he does fit into all of them too....

And I have to go now, more random toughts tomorrow.
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

Stefan Immel wrote:
> Here we go again
>
> Actually the first question you have to ask is: What is magic in the
> Feist universe (Feistverse?) ?
>
> This question alone is more than loaded. In Apprentice the only real
> "magic" known to mankind was the lesser path performed by Kuglan
> (there is the name you all where looking for). Macros was known to be
> very powerfull but he was the only human (is / was he really human?)
> who could perform anything more powerfull than that. Elves had a
> different kind of magic that somehow more worked in a druidic kind of
> way.
> Then there are the priest of the different gods who also could perform
> things that you could define as magic.
>
> To borrow some definitions from D&D (which was the basis for the
> whole Feist universe):
> Magic is based on spells which have to be learned. It is based on
> learning and intelligence.
> Druidic Magic is based on the nature and the ability to shape and
> influence it.
> Cleric Magic is based on faith to the gods and their intervention.
>
> Nakor (I finaly had to come to him, didn't I?) doesn't fit into any
> of this category and he does fit into all of them too....
>
> And I have to go now, more random toughts tomorrow.

I look forward to them .
--
Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

"~misfit~" <misfit61nz.DeleteThis@yahooo.co.nz> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:4473b9fe@news2.actrix.gen.nz...
> I look forward to them .
Here they come

Lets get back to the 3 different types of magic and how they are performed
and compare that to what Nakor does.

First there is the basic, scholar type of magic. For that most people need
to learn spells and "cast" them. As far as I remember greater and lesser
path may be mutually exclusive to each other but both work basically the
same way in that you habe to learn and cast spells.

Nakor never learned a spell in his live, at last not that it was mentioned
in the books, and he doesn't seemed to cast them as well.

Druidic (now that I think of it, it should be better called elven magic)
seems to me more based on the fact that the magic user cummunicates with
natur and "asks" her to perform certain things for him. In the same way
Priests pray to their gods for Intervention and this prayer is answerd.

Nakor never really prays or "talks" to natur.

All three kinds of magic could be different ways to look at the same thing.
The human mind need references to basically shape reality, be it that it is
the structur of a magic spell or the belive in a god that changes the things
the "caster" wants to change. In essence you don't need spells, natur or
good to do the change for you, you perform the change yourself, everything
else just helps your mind to do that.

This actually fits in nicely with the concept that the gods are created by
the humans (at least partly) and their believe in them.

Nakor has a totally different, much simpler reference to shape reality. He
uses Tricks. Actually I think he hasn't quite figured out how all this
really works, because that's not possible for the human mind, but he is much
nearer to the truth then most others are.


Flight of the Nighthawks Spoiler follows.


S


P


O


I


L


E


R


In Addition to all that is Nakor at least partly a "Dream" of a dead god.
This means in him is a part / quality of the essence / being / concept of a
god (at least that's how I understand it). He doesn't know what he is
exactly and so he acts and feels human most of the time.

My thought have reached a point where I have to sleep over them, perhaps
more tomorrow.
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

"Stefan Immel" <stefan.TakeThisOut@starocotes.de> wrote in message
news:e4v5im$vpb$02$1@news.t-online.com...
Kuglan (there is the name you all where looking for).


You mean Kulgan
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>"Stefan Immel" <stefan DeleteThis @starocotes.de> wrote in message
>news:e4v5im$vpb$02$1@news.t-online.com...
>Kuglan (there is the name you all where looking for).


>You mean Kulgan

I thought he had intentionally left out the name in elf fashion. I guess I
was just reading too much into it.
--
Joker
"...God hath made me to laugh, so that all that hear will laugh with me."
Gen. 21:6
 >> Stay informed about: Rereading Magician 

Joker wrote:
>> "Stefan Immel" <stefan.TakeThisOut@starocotes.de> wrote in message
>> news:e4v5im$vpb$02$1@news.t-online.com...
>> Kuglan (there is the name you all where looking for).
>
>
>> You mean Kulgan
>
> I thought he had intentionally left out the name in elf fashion. I
> guess I was just reading too much into it.

Heh! More like Alzheimers.
--
Shaun.
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