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External
Since: Nov 08, 2007
Posts: 33
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:20 pm
Post subject: Snide parodies
Archived from groups: alt>books>david-weber (more info?)
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From John Ringo's _The Hero_:
"Whatcha reading, Thor?" Shiva asked, needing a break from the silence.
"Deri Weaver's new one, _Dust of Success_," Thor replied enthusiastically.
"Intergalactic space fleet warfare. National politics, unit wrangling,
assorted government idiocy and exploding spaceships. Some of it's based
on Napoleonic naval warfare and World War II from old Earth."
--
Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6 http://rule6.info/
<*> <*> <*>
Heterosexuality is a choice |
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External
Since: Jun 24, 2007
Posts: 18
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Sep 25, 2007 5:19 pm
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Aahz Maruch wrote:
> From John Ringo's _The Hero_:
>
> "Whatcha reading, Thor?" Shiva asked, needing a break from the silence.
>
> "Deri Weaver's new one, _Dust of Success_," Thor replied enthusiastically.
> "Intergalactic space fleet warfare. National politics, unit wrangling,
> assorted government idiocy and exploding spaceships. Some of it's based
> on Napoleonic naval warfare and World War II from old Earth."
Recently, in another newsgroup (rec.arts.sf.written), in a thread
concerning the passing of author Robert Jordan, when some people
criticized him for being prolix, I observed that criticizing his flaws
on the occasion of his passing was particularly uncalled for... when
we have authors like Terry Goodkind to kick around.
The thread spiralled out into a number of directions, and the subject
of Terry Brooks' Shanarra series of novels was raised. It was noted
that these novels really didn't increase the amount of literature
comparable and similar to "The Lord of the Rings" that was available.
I couldn't resist the opportunity to parody some of the elements of
the Honor Harrington series that lend themselves to it at that point.
"What the world needs", I claimed, was novels in which a Polish woman
scientist invents a personal force field... so powerful that the only
lethal weapon left is a sort of atomic-powered chainsaw that looks
like a sword.
Just as David Weber constructed a set of future technologies that
created a world resembling the era of Horatio Nelson, I had the Mark
III Extend medical technology cause the hero to, at the age of 33,
look like a 16-year-old girl *and* make her four feet tall *and* grow
hair on her feet. (Usually, that's taken care of by depilatories, but
due to the radiation level aboard ship, people can't irritate their
skin with depilatories or even shave regularly there.)
But, of course, the Honor Harrington novels are, deservedly, very
popular. It isn't just because of the exciting space battles. Honor
Harrington is a character who is brought to life, and who is very
sympathetic.
One of the virtues of the Honor Harrington series that could be (and
probably is) remarked upon is that the villains aren't cardboard cut-
outs. Their motivations are very clearly presented, and made
believable.
John Savard |
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Since: Sep 11, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:49 am
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Quadibloc <jsavard DeleteThis @ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
news:1190765955.255963.53240@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com:
> Aahz Maruch wrote:
>> From John Ringo's _The Hero_:
>>
>> "Whatcha reading, Thor?" Shiva asked, needing a break from
>> the silence.
>>
>> "Deri Weaver's new one, _Dust of Success_," Thor replied
>> enthusiastically. "Intergalactic space fleet warfare.
>> National politics, unit wrangling, assorted government
>> idiocy and exploding spaceships. Some of it's based on
>> Napoleonic naval warfare and World War II from old Earth."
>
Followed by the glazing over of the eyes....
>
> I couldn't resist the opportunity to parody some of the
> elements of the Honor Harrington series that lend
> themselves to it at that point. "What the world needs", I
> claimed, was novels in which a Polish woman scientist
> invents a personal force field... so powerful that the only
> lethal weapon left is a sort of atomic-powered chainsaw
> that looks like a sword.
>
> Just as David Weber constructed a set of future
> technologies that created a world resembling the era of
> Horatio Nelson, I had the Mark III Extend medical
> technology cause the hero to, at the age of 33, look like a
> 16-year-old girl *and* make her four feet tall *and* grow
> hair on her feet. (Usually, that's taken care of by
> depilatories, but due to the radiation level aboard ship,
> people can't irritate their skin with depilatories or even
> shave regularly there.)
I always wondered -- did DW start with the "Age of Sail" concept
and then invented the Warshawski sail, or did he start with the
sail and extrapolated the culture?
>
> But, of course, the Honor Harrington novels are,
> deservedly, very popular. It isn't just because of the
> exciting space battles. Honor Harrington is a character who
> is brought to life, and who is very sympathetic.
>
> One of the virtues of the Honor Harrington series that
> could be (and probably is) remarked upon is that the
> villains aren't cardboard cut- outs. Their motivations are
> very clearly presented, and made believable.
>
> John Savard
>
Rob. S. Pierre.
--
=========================
TheWanderer >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Since: Sep 18, 2007
Posts: 24
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:49 am
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"TheWanderer" <usenet.DeleteThis@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Xns99B6D3F534BEerictzoneabpeg@216.151.153.48...
> Quadibloc <jsavard.DeleteThis@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
> news:1190765955.255963.53240@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Aahz Maruch wrote:
>>> From John Ringo's _The Hero_:
>>>
>>> "Whatcha reading, Thor?" Shiva asked, needing a break from
>>> the silence.
>>>
>>> "Deri Weaver's new one, _Dust of Success_," Thor replied
>>> enthusiastically. "Intergalactic space fleet warfare.
>>> National politics, unit wrangling, assorted government
>>> idiocy and exploding spaceships. Some of it's based on
>>> Napoleonic naval warfare and World War II from old Earth."
>>
>
> Followed by the glazing over of the eyes....
>
>
>>
>> I couldn't resist the opportunity to parody some of the
>> elements of the Honor Harrington series that lend
>> themselves to it at that point. "What the world needs", I
>> claimed, was novels in which a Polish woman scientist
>> invents a personal force field... so powerful that the only
>> lethal weapon left is a sort of atomic-powered chainsaw
>> that looks like a sword.
>>
>> Just as David Weber constructed a set of future
>> technologies that created a world resembling the era of
>> Horatio Nelson, I had the Mark III Extend medical
>> technology cause the hero to, at the age of 33, look like a
>> 16-year-old girl *and* make her four feet tall *and* grow
>> hair on her feet. (Usually, that's taken care of by
>> depilatories, but due to the radiation level aboard ship,
>> people can't irritate their skin with depilatories or even
>> shave regularly there.)
>
> I always wondered -- did DW start with the "Age of Sail" concept
> and then invented the Warshawski sail, or did he start with the
> sail and extrapolated the culture?
The former...
He was trying to come up with a Horatio Hornblower in space
concept, at Jim Baen's urging.
>
>>
>> But, of course, the Honor Harrington novels are,
>> deservedly, very popular. It isn't just because of the
>> exciting space battles. Honor Harrington is a character who
>> is brought to life, and who is very sympathetic.
>>
>> One of the virtues of the Honor Harrington series that
>> could be (and probably is) remarked upon is that the
>> villains aren't cardboard cut- outs. Their motivations are
>> very clearly presented, and made believable.
>>
>> John Savard
>>
>
> Rob. S. Pierre.
>
> --
> =========================
>
> TheWanderer
> >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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External
Since: Feb 07, 2008
Posts: 100
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:49 pm
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Tue, 25 Sep 2007 22:33:09 -0400, "Fred Burton"
<fburton.RemoveThis@biteme2.com> wrote:
>
>"TheWanderer" <usenet.RemoveThis@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:Xns99B6D3F534BEerictzoneabpeg@216.151.153.48...
>> I always wondered -- did DW start with the "Age of Sail" concept
>> and then invented the Warshawski sail, or did he start with the
>> sail and extrapolated the culture?
>
>The former...
>
>He was trying to come up with a Horatio Hornblower in space
>concept, at Jim Baen's urging.
>
I offered him an expansion on the concept - that, as WIlliam Ellern
pointed out in "Moon Prospector", lasers (or any other energy weapon
of less than 100% energy conversion efficiency) really aren't actually
all tat practical for spaceships, 'cos the heat generated has to go
*somewhere*[1]. A spaceship can't radiate heat nearly as fast as it
would build up in an action with significant use of the beam weapons.
So i suggested that each laser/graser mount be provided with blocks of
metallic sodium, which would be loaded against the "breech" of the
weapon before each shot, and would carry off the heat by vapourising
and being exhausted to space.
Forming a cloud of "gunsmoke" that neither sensors nor lasers could
penetrate till the ship moved on and left it behind...
(This would also create a "magazine capacity" limit, like unto the
windjammers of the Napoleonic Age, too.
[1] Consider a weapon which converts 99.99% of the input to downrange
energy. If you put a gigajoule in, you will get 100K joule out the
back - as energy.
And i refuse to believe in a beam weapon that's even *nearly as
efficient as *that*.
--
mike weber (fairportfan@gmail.com)
============================
My Website: http://electronictiger.com
===================================
No use looking for the answers when the questions are in doubt - Fred leBlanc, "The Love of My Life" >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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External
Since: Aug 13, 2003
Posts: 1477
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 9:46 pm
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"mike weber" <fairportfan.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r3fqf398pbsh69rdq1tkbcd2nkl4krv52d@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 25 Sep 2007 22:33:09 -0400, "Fred Burton"
> <fburton.RemoveThis@biteme2.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"TheWanderer" <usenet.RemoveThis@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
>>news:Xns99B6D3F534BEerictzoneabpeg@216.151.153.48...
>
>
>>> I always wondered -- did DW start with the "Age of Sail" concept
>>> and then invented the Warshawski sail, or did he start with the
>>> sail and extrapolated the culture?
>>
>>The former...
>>
>>He was trying to come up with a Horatio Hornblower in space
>>concept, at Jim Baen's urging.
>>
>
> I offered him an expansion on the concept - that, as WIlliam Ellern
> pointed out in "Moon Prospector", lasers (or any other energy weapon
> of less than 100% energy conversion efficiency) really aren't actually
> all tat practical for spaceships, 'cos the heat generated has to go
> *somewhere*[1]. A spaceship can't radiate heat nearly as fast as it
> would build up in an action with significant use of the beam weapons.
>
> So i suggested that each laser/graser mount be provided with blocks of
> metallic sodium, which would be loaded against the "breech" of the
> weapon before each shot, and would carry off the heat by vapourising
> and being exhausted to space.
>
> Forming a cloud of "gunsmoke" that neither sensors nor lasers could
> penetrate till the ship moved on and left it behind...
>
> (This would also create a "magazine capacity" limit, like unto the
> windjammers of the Napoleonic Age, too.
>
> [1] Consider a weapon which converts 99.99% of the input to downrange
> energy. If you put a gigajoule in, you will get 100K joule out the
> back - as energy.
>
> And i refuse to believe in a beam weapon that's even *nearly as
> efficient as *that*.
>
>
Darn, you do have a point. We also can't afford to look at the source of the
energy going into that system and how it is converted into electricity in
the first place or the size of the ships could be explained as heat sinks.
Um, I don't think you want a human crew anywhere near these lasers/grazers.
I still think that these ships are going to glow so hot on infrared that any
thought of stealth is bogus unless they are coasting with power off and have
been for some time. A long range lock on using several missiles with a
decent spread sharing data would work like a charm and fritzing it is not
going to work
> --
> mike weber (fairportfan@gmail.com)
> ============================
> My Website: http://electronictiger.com
> ===================================
> No use looking for the answers when the questions are in doubt - Fred
> leBlanc, "The Love of My Life" >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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External
Since: Sep 30, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 2:12 pm
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"deowll" <deowll.TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:p5ELi.60450$7e6.57478@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>
> "mike weber" <fairportfan.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:r3fqf398pbsh69rdq1tkbcd2nkl4krv52d@4ax.com...
> > On Tue, 25 Sep 2007 22:33:09 -0400, "Fred Burton"
> > <fburton.TakeThisOut@biteme2.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>"TheWanderer" <usenet.TakeThisOut@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>news:Xns99B6D3F534BEerictzoneabpeg@216.151.153.48...
> >
> >
> >>> I always wondered -- did DW start with the "Age of Sail" concept
> >>> and then invented the Warshawski sail, or did he start with the
> >>> sail and extrapolated the culture?
> >>
> >>The former...
> >>
> >>He was trying to come up with a Horatio Hornblower in space
> >>concept, at Jim Baen's urging.
> >>
> >
> > I offered him an expansion on the concept - that, as WIlliam Ellern
> > pointed out in "Moon Prospector", lasers (or any other energy weapon
> > of less than 100% energy conversion efficiency) really aren't actually
> > all tat practical for spaceships, 'cos the heat generated has to go
> > *somewhere*[1]. A spaceship can't radiate heat nearly as fast as it
> > would build up in an action with significant use of the beam weapons.
> >
> > So i suggested that each laser/graser mount be provided with blocks of
> > metallic sodium, which would be loaded against the "breech" of the
> > weapon before each shot, and would carry off the heat by vapourising
> > and being exhausted to space.
> >
> > Forming a cloud of "gunsmoke" that neither sensors nor lasers could
> > penetrate till the ship moved on and left it behind...
> >
> > (This would also create a "magazine capacity" limit, like unto the
> > windjammers of the Napoleonic Age, too.
> >
> > [1] Consider a weapon which converts 99.99% of the input to downrange
> > energy. If you put a gigajoule in, you will get 100K joule out the
> > back - as energy.
> >
> > And i refuse to believe in a beam weapon that's even *nearly as
> > efficient as *that*.
> >
> >
>
> Darn, you do have a point. We also can't afford to look at the source of
the
> energy going into that system and how it is converted into electricity in
> the first place or the size of the ships could be explained as heat sinks.
> Um, I don't think you want a human crew anywhere near these
lasers/grazers.
>
> I still think that these ships are going to glow so hot on infrared that
any
> thought of stealth is bogus unless they are coasting with power off and
have
> been for some time. A long range lock on using several missiles with a
> decent spread sharing data would work like a charm and fritzing it is not
> going to work
>
I kinda think that a technology level that supports superconducting
capacitor rings that can store mega/giga-watts of energy should be able to
use superconductors to sink the heat rapidly with any problem.
(If you don't buy that idea, then make sure you strengthen your 'willing
suspension of disbelief' and sit back and enjoy the show.) >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Since: Aug 26, 2003
Posts: 392
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 4:55 pm
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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After a Computer crash and the demise of civilization, it was learned
"Tim Neumann" <timothybil.RemoveThis@iowatelecom.net> wrote on Sun, 30 Sep 2007
14:12:02 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>
>> Darn, you do have a point. We also can't afford to look at the source of
>the
>> energy going into that system and how it is converted into electricity in
>> the first place or the size of the ships could be explained as heat sinks.
>> Um, I don't think you want a human crew anywhere near these
>lasers/grazers.
>>
>> I still think that these ships are going to glow so hot on infrared that
>any
>> thought of stealth is bogus unless they are coasting with power off and
>have
>> been for some time. A long range lock on using several missiles with a
>> decent spread sharing data would work like a charm and fritzing it is not
>> going to work
>>
>I kinda think that a technology level that supports superconducting
>capacitor rings that can store mega/giga-watts of energy should be able to
>use superconductors to sink the heat rapidly with any problem.
>
>(If you don't buy that idea, then make sure you strengthen your 'willing
>suspension of disbelief' and sit back and enjoy the show.)
Refrigerators, great big honking freezers. That is what is taking
up all the space in the ships, the mother loving huge refrigerators.
And all those swimming pools? As part of the preparation for
battle, those get frozen, to serve as heat sinks.
tschus
pyotr
"it's turtles, all the way down!"
--
pyotr filipivich
We now return you to something called reality. >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Since: Feb 07, 2008
Posts: 100
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:03 am
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 14:12:02 -0500, "Tim Neumann"
<timothybil RemoveThis @iowatelecom.net> wrote:
>I kinda think that a technology level that supports superconducting
>capacitor rings that can store mega/giga-watts of energy should be able to
>use superconductors to sink the heat rapidly with any problem.
There's no place to sink it *to*, except the ship's own structure, and
that's gonna have a limited capacity (at least relative to the amount
of energy released).
I just ignore this sort of thing, though - and not just in Dave's
books, either.
--
mike weber (fairportfan@gmail.com)
============================
My Website: http://electronictiger.com
===================================
No use looking for the answers when the questions are in doubt - Fred leBlanc, "The Love of My Life" >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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External
Since: Apr 13, 2005
Posts: 440
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:03 am
Post subject: Re: Snide parodies [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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mike weber wrote:
> There's no place to sink it *to*, except the ship's own structure, and
> that's gonna have a limited capacity (at least relative to the amount
> of energy released).
>
> I just ignore this sort of thing, though - and not just in Dave's
> books, either.
>
Don't the wedge and sidewalls block light, and therefore IR? The ship
should glow like crazy from the front or back, but the buckler could
help there (now).
I still suspect a second, smaller, sidewall could be set up inside the
regular sidewall. Maybe even a third, even smaller, inside the second. >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Since: Feb 07, 2008
Posts: 100
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:04 am
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On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 16:55:51 -0700, pyotr filipivich
<phamp DeleteThis @mindspring.com> wrote:
> Refrigerators, great big honking freezers. That is what is taking
>up all the space in the ships, the mother loving huge refrigerators.
> And all those swimming pools? As part of the preparation for
>battle, those get frozen, to serve as heat sinks.
Still not enough heat sink.
And what do the freezers do with the heat they extrract from what
they're freezing?
It's a closed system.
--
mike weber (fairportfan@gmail.com)
============================
My Website: http://electronictiger.com
===================================
No use looking for the answers when the questions are in doubt - Fred leBlanc, "The Love of My Life" >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Since: Jan 09, 2006
Posts: 61
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:32 pm
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mike weber kirjoitti:
> On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 14:12:02 -0500, "Tim Neumann"
> <timothybil.DeleteThis@iowatelecom.net> wrote:
>
>> I kinda think that a technology level that supports superconducting
>> capacitor rings that can store mega/giga-watts of energy should be able to
>> use superconductors to sink the heat rapidly with any problem.
>
> There's no place to sink it *to*, except the ship's own structure, and
> that's gonna have a limited capacity (at least relative to the amount
> of energy released).
>
> I just ignore this sort of thing, though - and not just in Dave's
> books, either.
What about energy bleed out of the propulsion system? IIRC there was
something about ... oh yes.
"<i>Fearless</i> hit the gamma wall, and her Warshawski sails bled
transit energy like an azure forest fire."
(Sorry about the HTML, I didn't open the ebooks in a browser, I just did
a grep.)
Couldn't off-hand find a mention on whether or nor it'd work with a wedge. >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Since: Aug 26, 2003
Posts: 392
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:01 pm
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After a Computer crash and the demise of civilization, it was learned
mike weber <fairportfan.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote on Mon, 01 Oct 2007 07:03:38
-0400 in alt.books.david-weber :
>On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 14:12:02 -0500, "Tim Neumann"
><timothybil.RemoveThis@iowatelecom.net> wrote:
>
>>I kinda think that a technology level that supports superconducting
>>capacitor rings that can store mega/giga-watts of energy should be able to
>>use superconductors to sink the heat rapidly with any problem.
>
>There's no place to sink it *to*, except the ship's own structure, and
>that's gonna have a limited capacity (at least relative to the amount
>of energy released).
>
>I just ignore this sort of thing, though - and not just in Dave's
>books, either.
That's the real source of 'white holes": alien races have figured
out how to beam the excess energy to an central location, where it is
phased shifted into another reality (ours) and appears as a white hole
(the opposite of a black hole.)
--
pyotr filipivich
The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes." >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Posts: 392
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 3:01 pm
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After a Computer crash and the demise of civilization, it was learned
mike weber <fairportfan.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote on Mon, 01 Oct 2007 07:04:39
-0400 in alt.books.david-weber :
>On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 16:55:51 -0700, pyotr filipivich
><phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>> Refrigerators, great big honking freezers. That is what is taking
>>up all the space in the ships, the mother loving huge refrigerators.
>> And all those swimming pools? As part of the preparation for
>>battle, those get frozen, to serve as heat sinks.
>
>Still not enough heat sink.
>
>And what do the freezers do with the heat they extrract from what
>they're freezing?
>
>It's a closed system.
Like I said "it's turtle all the way down." Which is why the SD(P)
are so big. You just think those are pods, but half of them are heat
sinks taking the excess heat with them.
Really, just keep adding refrigerators until you've solved the
problem (by making a thermally conductive contact with a planetary body,
or a ship to massive to lift.
tschus
pyotr
--
pyotr filipivich
We now return you to something called reality. >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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Posts: 75
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 5:41 pm
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"mike weber" <fairportfan.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:q0l1g3l4hru1mfef4tphqadj2rrkd3re9f@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 16:55:51 -0700, pyotr filipivich
> <phamp.TakeThisOut@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>> Refrigerators, great big honking freezers. That is what is taking
>>up all the space in the ships, the mother loving huge refrigerators.
>> And all those swimming pools? As part of the preparation for
>>battle, those get frozen, to serve as heat sinks.
>
> Still not enough heat sink.
>
> And what do the freezers do with the heat they extrract from what
> they're freezing?
>
> It's a closed system.
>
> --
> mike weber (fairportfan@gmail.com)
> ============================
> My Website: http://electronictiger.com
> ===================================
> No use looking for the answers when the questions are in doubt - Fred
> leBlanc, "The Love of My Life"
large thin rectangular 'sheets' of superconducter mesh? lessee for best
effect you'ld want to spread them out so that they didn't radiate back at
the ship(mast) and some sort of frame to keep them spread(spars). since you
don't want them shot away in combat you would want to stow them
away(clearing the decks).
rex >> Stay informed about: Snide parodies |
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