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External
Since: Mar 20, 2007
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 46) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 6:29 am
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>tv>stargate-sg1, others (more info?)
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"Don Sample" <dsample.RemoveThis@synapse.net> wrote in message
news:dsample-F1D83C.01375825032007@news.giganews.com...
> In article <rj1c03lsb8gim7l9sv5909s0tjudupbb6f.RemoveThis@4ax.com>,
> David Johnston <david.RemoveThis@block.net> wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 25 Mar 2007 00:16:37 GMT, Rich Corinthian Leather
> > <inexplicable.RemoveThis@mysterious.net> wrote:
> >
> > >Tim Bruening wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
> > >>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni.RemoveThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
> > >>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
> > >>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs Xindi
planet
> > >>>>> destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the planet destroyer
from
> > >>>>> Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs Shadow Crab (Babylon 5).
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>> Death Star.
> > >>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star in
> > >>> seconds!
> > >>
> > >> How?
> > >>
> > >It could be loaded with anti-matter, programmed as a bomb, or even
> > >transported inside the Death Star at its weakest point as a booby trap.
> >
> > Except of course that antimatter explosions on Star Trek don't seem to
> > be particularly a big thing. Note that they do NOT use antimatter to
> > blow up Borg Cubes with one shot as they should be able to.
>
> I can only think of one instance in all of Trek when they ever actually
> used an anti-matter bomb. The TOS episode with the blood sucking gas
> cloud.
>
> In several of the Borg episodes, where they were freely beaming back and
> forth to Borg cubes I asked "Why don't they just beam over a couple of
> kilos of anti-matter?"
>
Kilos? That would be suicide. Half a gram would be too much already, I
think.
But you cannot just beam over raw anti-matter. It must be held inside some
sophisticated mechanism specially engineered to prevent the anti-matter from
getting in contact with matter of this universe before the time of
detonation. But any sophisticated engineering gadgetry would not have gone
unnoticed by the Borg, especially weaponry.
But I never bought into the idea that the Borg would let anybody beam in and
out unchecked because they did not perceive the lowly humans as a threat.
That was just too convenient. Silly writers' perogative, I think.
--
==Harmony Watcher== |
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mariposas rand mair fheal
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External
Since: Mar 25, 2007
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 47) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 6:29 am
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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> But you cannot just beam over raw anti-matter. It must be held inside some
> sophisticated mechanism specially engineered to prevent the anti-matter from
> getting in contact with matter of this universe before the time of
isnt that called a photon torpedo
ah cinema insomonia with mr lobo
must dash - - - -
meow arf meow - they are performing horrible experiments in space
major grubert is watching you - beware the bakalite
impeach the bastard - the airtight garage has you neo |
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External
Since: Jul 01, 2004
Posts: 285
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(Msg. 48) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 6:29 am
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <cFoNh.66725$DN.66368@pd7urf2no>,
"\(Harmony\) Watcher" <nobody.DeleteThis@nonesuch.com> wrote:
> "Don Sample" <dsample.DeleteThis@synapse.net> wrote in message
> news:dsample-F1D83C.01375825032007@news.giganews.com...
> > In article <rj1c03lsb8gim7l9sv5909s0tjudupbb6f.DeleteThis@4ax.com>,
> > David Johnston <david.DeleteThis@block.net> wrote:
> >
> > > On Sun, 25 Mar 2007 00:16:37 GMT, Rich Corinthian Leather
> > > <inexplicable.DeleteThis@mysterious.net> wrote:
> > >
> > > >Tim Bruening wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
> > > >>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
> > > >>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
> > > >>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs Xindi
> planet
> > > >>>>> destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the planet destroyer
> from
> > > >>>>> Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs Shadow Crab (Babylon 5).
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>>>
> > > >>>> Death Star.
> > > >>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star in
> > > >>> seconds!
> > > >>
> > > >> How?
> > > >>
> > > >It could be loaded with anti-matter, programmed as a bomb, or even
> > > >transported inside the Death Star at its weakest point as a booby trap.
> > >
> > > Except of course that antimatter explosions on Star Trek don't seem to
> > > be particularly a big thing. Note that they do NOT use antimatter to
> > > blow up Borg Cubes with one shot as they should be able to.
> >
> > I can only think of one instance in all of Trek when they ever actually
> > used an anti-matter bomb. The TOS episode with the blood sucking gas
> > cloud.
> >
> > In several of the Borg episodes, where they were freely beaming back and
> > forth to Borg cubes I asked "Why don't they just beam over a couple of
> > kilos of anti-matter?"
> >
> Kilos? That would be suicide. Half a gram would be too much already, I
> think.
1 kilogram of anti-matter is "only" the equivalent of a 40 Mt nuclear
explosion. The Russians blew up a bigger bomb than that, once. (About
the only time they ever decided "Okay, that weapon was *too* big.")
--
Quando omni flunkus moritati
Visit the Buffy Body Count at <http://homepage.mac.com/dsample/> >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 49) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 3:22 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
> Tim Bruening wrote:
>>
>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>
>>> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
>>>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni RemoveThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
>>>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
>>>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs Xindi
>>>>>> planet destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the planet
>>>>>> destroyer from Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs Shadow
>>>>>> Crab (Babylon 5).
>>>>> Death Star.
>>>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star
>>>> in seconds!
>>>>
>>> Only if it was allowed to come near the thing and had advanced
>>> intell about its weakness.
>>> What to do about all those turbo lasers and TIE fighters?
>>
>> The 2nd Death Star fixed the flaw Luke Skywalker exploited, so an
>> Enterprise shuttle would not be able to destroy Death Star 2.
>>
> The OP didn't state whether the Death Star in the proposed
> conflagration was the original or updated one!
>
> Of all the ships of destruction originally mentioned, the Death Star
> (presuming the original version) and the planet-destroyer from TOS,
> would be the weakest while the Shadow Crab (B5) would be the
> strongest, IMHO.
>
> The weakest ships would fare poorly because of design and apparent
> lack of defensive capability. The Shadow Crab is the strongest
> because it's nearly impossible to destroy. (If I recall, didn't it
> require help from the Ancients and the combined Younger Races' forces
> to destroy it)?
Currently I'm rewatching Babylon 5 (just finished season 1).
I recall them being tough, but not exactly /that/ tough.
Besides, there was of course more than one SC. If I remember correctly the
first kill was made by Sheridan by some fancy maneuvering from that first
White Star.
--
Wouter Valentijn
www.wouter.cc
www.nksf.nl
http://www.nksf.scifics.com/Nom20062007.html
www.zeppodunsel.nl
liam=mail
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"
Order given by David Farragut at the Battle of Mobile Bay >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 50) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 3:52 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges wrote:
>> But you cannot just beam over raw anti-matter. It must be held
>> inside some sophisticated mechanism specially engineered to prevent
>> the anti-matter from getting in contact with matter of this universe
>> before the time of
>
> isnt that called a photon torpedo
Indeed.
Janeway did it ones.
She deployed the tactic against one of the minor Borg vessels.
--
Wouter Valentijn
www.wouter.cc
www.nksf.nl
http://www.nksf.scifics.com/Nom20062007.html
www.zeppodunsel.nl
liam=mail
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"
Order given by David Farragut at the Battle of Mobile Bay >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 51) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 3:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Don Sample wrote:
> In article <rj1c03lsb8gim7l9sv5909s0tjudupbb6f DeleteThis @4ax.com>,
> David Johnston <david DeleteThis @block.net> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 25 Mar 2007 00:16:37 GMT, Rich Corinthian Leather
>> <inexplicable DeleteThis @mysterious.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Tim Bruening wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>>>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
>>>>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
>>>>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs
>>>>>>> Xindi planet destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the
>>>>>>> planet destroyer from Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs
>>>>>>> Shadow Crab (Babylon 5).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Death Star.
>>>>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star
>>>>> in seconds!
>>>>
>>>> How?
>>>>
>>> It could be loaded with anti-matter, programmed as a bomb, or even
>>> transported inside the Death Star at its weakest point as a booby
>>> trap.
>>
>> Except of course that antimatter explosions on Star Trek don't seem
>> to be particularly a big thing. Note that they do NOT use
>> antimatter to blow up Borg Cubes with one shot as they should be
>> able to.
>
> I can only think of one instance in all of Trek when they ever
> actually used an anti-matter bomb. The TOS episode with the blood
> sucking gas cloud.
>
'Obession', aka 'Jimmy The Vampire Slayer'.
They also used anti-matter against the space amoebe in 'The Immunity
Syndrome'.
They might have used it in 'The Doomsday Machine', but anti-matter of the
Constellation had been 'de-activated' somehow. Maybe by some field the
Planet Killer put out.
> In several of the Borg episodes, where they were freely beaming back
> and forth to Borg cubes I asked "Why don't they just beam over a
> couple of kilos of anti-matter?"
They did once.
--
Wouter Valentijn
www.wouter.cc
www.nksf.nl
http://www.nksf.scifics.com/Nom20062007.html
www.zeppodunsel.nl
liam=mail
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"
Order given by David Farragut at the Battle of Mobile Bay >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 19, 2007
Posts: 8
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(Msg. 52) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:06 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>tv>stargate-sg1, others (more info?)
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Wouter Valentijn <liam.RemoveThis@valentijn.nu> did eloquently scribble:
> whodunit wrote:
>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>> whodunit wrote:
>>>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>>>> <spike1.RemoveThis@freenet.co.uk> schreef in bericht
>>>>> news:aqe3d4-g93.ln1@ridcully.ntlworld.com...
>>>>>> Wouter Valentijn <liam.RemoveThis@valentijn.nu> did eloquently scribble:
>>>>>>> I don't know Aslan.
>>>>>> Don't KNOW ASLAN?!
>>>>>> Tisk...
>>>>>> The lion, the witch and the wardrobe.
>>>>>> (and all the other narnia books with the possible exception of
>>>>>> horse and his
>>>>>> boy, can't remember if aslan appeared in that one)
>>>>> Ah...
>>>>> Never read the book.
>>>>> Didn't see the movie.
>>>>> I asume Aslan had some type of magic power?
>>>>>
>>>> Overcoming death was pretty magical.
>>>
>>> But not very exceptional.
>>>
>>>
>> Some of us think it was VERY exceptional. 
> Not to me.
> Other fictional that overcame death:
> McCoy (Shore Leave)
> Scotty (The Changeling)
> Spock (The Search for Spock)
> Several of the X-Men
> Superman
You forgot daniel jackson and jack o'niell.
--
______________________________________________________________________________
| spike1.RemoveThis@freenet.co.uk | "Are you pondering what I'm pondering Pinky?" |
|Andrew Halliwell BSc(hons)| |
| in | "I think so brain, but this time, you control |
| Computer Science | the Encounter suit, and I'll do the voice..." |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 53) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>tv>stargate-sg1, others (more info?)
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Tim Bruening wrote:
> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>
>> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
>>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
>>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
>>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs Xindi
>>>>> planet destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the planet
>>>>> destroyer from Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs Shadow
>>>>> Crab (Babylon 5).
>>>>
>>>> Death Star.
>>>
>>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star in
>>> seconds!
>>>
>>
>> Only if it was allowed to come near the thing and had advanced
>> intell about its weakness.
>> What to do about all those turbo lasers and TIE fighters?
>
> The 2nd Death Star fixed the flaw Luke Skywalker exploited, so an
> Enterprise shuttle would not be able to destroy Death Star 2.
Unless a command team was able to take out the shield station on Endor.
Of course they would still need to get inside that shield undetected.
And there is the trouble brought to you by the DS's own defences.
--
Wouter Valentijn
www.wouter.cc
www.nksf.nl
http://www.nksf.scifics.com/Nom20062007.html
www.zeppodunsel.nl
liam=mail
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"
Order given by David Farragut at the Battle of Mobile Bay >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Dec 06, 2003
Posts: 895
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(Msg. 54) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Wouter Valentijn wrote:
> Tim Bruening wrote:
> > Wouter Valentijn wrote:
> >
> >> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
> >>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
> >>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
> >>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
> >>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs Xindi
> >>>>> planet destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the planet
> >>>>> destroyer from Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs Shadow
> >>>>> Crab (Babylon 5).
> >>>>
> >>>> Death Star.
> >>>
> >>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star in
> >>> seconds!
> >>>
> >>
> >> Only if it was allowed to come near the thing and had advanced
> >> intell about its weakness.
> >> What to do about all those turbo lasers and TIE fighters?
> >
> > The 2nd Death Star fixed the flaw Luke Skywalker exploited, so an
> > Enterprise shuttle would not be able to destroy Death Star 2.
>
> Unless a command team was able to take out the shield station on Endor.
> Of course they would still need to get inside that shield undetected.
> And there is the trouble brought to you by the DS's own defences.
And then we have the Emperor 2nd in command having an attack of
sentimentality and killing the Emperor. >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 20, 2007
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 55) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:02 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges"
<mair_fheal.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mair_fheal-BE322A.00010225032007@sn-ip.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net...
> > But you cannot just beam over raw anti-matter. It must be held inside
some
> > sophisticated mechanism specially engineered to prevent the anti-matter
from
> > getting in contact with matter of this universe before the time of
>
> isnt that called a photon torpedo
>
No. The pudding is in the delivery mechanism and a small element of
"stealth"--from the human's perspective--if it were beamed over to the
cube[1]. Attacking directly with a photon torpedo was demonstrably useless
against the Borg unless the Borg collective was first put into "sleep" mode
(as Locutus/Picard told Data to do) so their shields could be lowered
rendering the Borg cube susceptible to attack by even outdated technologies.
[1]Arguably, nothing technological would have escaped the Borg's scrutiny,
and everything technological could be viewed as a potential weapon.
--
==Harmony Watcher== >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 56) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:46 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Tim Bruening wrote:
> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>
>> Tim Bruening wrote:
>>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>>
>>>> Rich Corinthian Leather wrote:
>>>>> Wouter Valentijn wrote:
>>>>>> "Tim Bruening" <tsbrueni.DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> schreef in bericht
>>>>>> news:4600DE34.EC357101@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us...
>>>>>>> Goa'uld mother ship (Stargate) vs Borg Cube (Star Trek) vs Xindi
>>>>>>> planet destroying sphere (Enterprise: Twilight) vs the planet
>>>>>>> destroyer from Classic Trek vs Death Star (Star Wars) vs Shadow
>>>>>>> Crab (Babylon 5).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Death Star.
>>>>>
>>>>> Oh, please, an Enterprise-era shuttle could wipe out a Death Star
>>>>> in seconds!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Only if it was allowed to come near the thing and had advanced
>>>> intell about its weakness.
>>>> What to do about all those turbo lasers and TIE fighters?
>>>
>>> The 2nd Death Star fixed the flaw Luke Skywalker exploited, so an
>>> Enterprise shuttle would not be able to destroy Death Star 2.
>>
>> Unless a command team was able to take out the shield station on
>> Endor. Of course they would still need to get inside that shield
>> undetected. And there is the trouble brought to you by the DS's own
>> defences.
>
> And then we have the Emperor 2nd in command having an attack of
> sentimentality and killing the Emperor.
Only because Lord Sidious was killing his son Luke.
--
Wouter Valentijn
www.wouter.cc
www.nksf.nl
http://www.nksf.scifics.com/Nom20062007.html
www.zeppodunsel.nl
liam=mail
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"
Order given by David Farragut at the Battle of Mobile Bay >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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mariposas rand mair fheal
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External
Since: Mar 25, 2007
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 57) Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:46 pm
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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> >> Unless a command team was able to take out the shield station on
> >> Endor. Of course they would still need to get inside that shield
> >> undetected. And there is the trouble brought to you by the DS's own
> >> defences.
> >
> > And then we have the Emperor 2nd in command having an attack of
> > sentimentality and killing the Emperor.
>
> Only because Lord Sidious was killing his son Luke.
would bush the elder side with carter or his own spawn shrub
meow arf meow - they are performing horrible experiments in space
major grubert is watching you - beware the bakalite
impeach the bastard - the airtight garage has you neo >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 12
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(Msg. 58) Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2007 4:24 pm
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mariposas rand mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges wrote:
>>>> Unless a command team was able to take out the shield station on
>>>> Endor. Of course they would still need to get inside that shield
>>>> undetected. And there is the trouble brought to you by the DS's own
>>>> defences.
>>>
>>> And then we have the Emperor 2nd in command having an attack of
>>> sentimentality and killing the Emperor.
>>
>> Only because Lord Sidious was killing his son Luke.
>
> would bush the elder side with carter or his own spawn shrub
>
You're comparing Carter with Palpatine?
--
Wouter Valentijn
www.wouter.cc
www.nksf.nl
http://www.nksf.scifics.com/Nom20062007.html
www.zeppodunsel.nl
liam=mail
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!"
Order given by David Farragut at the Battle of Mobile Bay >> Stay informed about: Universes At War |
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External
Since: Mar 27, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 59) Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:37 am
Post subject: Re: Universes At War [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>tv>stargate-sg1, others (more info?)
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