War with the Solarian League?

Lunan wrote:
> I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
> shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
> me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>
> wait and follow me
>
> with talbott manticore has a MASSIVE manpower and potential industrial
> increase, it needs to educate the people and build infrastructe of
> course but in 20 t-years they could do that, the military (navy, army,
> marines) could do massive recriutment and offer that education for a
> certain time in service and build the military infrastructre (bases
> here and there, loacally produced ships and ship yards, etc)
> silsia can do the same
>
> maya sector will come in in favor of manticore causeing the bubing
> civil war, haven will join manticore
>
> ok i could go more indepth and i'm not6 saying this is the next novel
> or even gonna happen within the next 5 novels but i feel its coming
> (prob when honor is prime minister and her son and other potenial
> children are in the fight)
>
> so whatcha think?
>

There is supposed to be another 9 books to go yet (forget where I read
that) so yeah almost certainly this will happen. Otherwise it will get
very boring Haven and Manticore battering each other for next 9 novels.

Neil
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:

>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>
>wait and follow me

I'm sorry, but, well, duh.

Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
this point.
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

"Cheerful Iconoclast" <cheerfuliconoclast.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:ook343tr32shrhva49jsuf5jla3i0dqfca@4ax.com...
> On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>
>>wait and follow me
>
> I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>
> Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
> likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
> this point.

In a way. It is obvious that the League will become involved in the
fighting. I think the data on that goes back to the start of the series. DW
has said that if the League remains united it can not be defeated. He has
also pretty much indicated that the good guys don't get wiped out so....
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
<cheerfuliconoclast RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400 in
alt.books.david-weber :
>On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>
>>wait and follow me
>
>I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>
>Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>this point.

Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
and highly probable.
Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
fractured by civil war? What do you think?
--
pyotr filipivich
The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v@4ax.com...
> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
> <cheerfuliconoclast.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400 in
> alt.books.david-weber :
>>On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>>
>>>wait and follow me
>>
>>I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>
>>Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>this point.
>
> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
> and highly probable.
> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
> fractured by civil war? What do you think?

Civil wars are blood baths.


> --
> pyotr filipivich
> The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
> better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Don Sample <dsample.DeleteThis@synapse.net>
wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:09:14 -0400 in alt.books.david-weber :
>In article <iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v.DeleteThis@4ax.com>,
> pyotr filipivich <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>> <cheerfuliconoclast.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400 in
>> alt.books.david-weber :
>> >On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>> >>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>> >>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>> >>
>> >>wait and follow me
>> >
>> >I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>> >
>> >Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>> >likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>> >this point.
>>
>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
>> and highly probable.
>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>
>OTOP, the Star Kingdom might be well situated to make a killing by
>selling their second string weapons systems to all sides of the Solarian
>civil war.

True.

But I have trouble with figuring out the "galactic"equivalent of "Cash &
Carry".
--
pyotr filipivich
The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll.TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net>
wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:27:59 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>
>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.TakeThisOut@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>news:iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v@4ax.com...
>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>> <cheerfuliconoclast.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400 in
>> alt.books.david-weber :
>>>On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>>>
>>>>wait and follow me
>>>
>>>I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>>
>>>Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>>likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>>this point.
>>
>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
>> and highly probable.
>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>
>Civil wars are blood baths.

And there goes the economies of the various planets in the Solarian
League, and along with that, any trade into or out of those areas. Some
planets outside the league may not notice (grayson, Masada, the fringe
areas of the Talbot cluster) but if there was any trade with Solarian
Space, even indirectly, that is going to be "lost" For The Duration.
--
pyotr filipivich
The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

"pyotr filipivich" <phamp RemoveThis @mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:rii843d3bmdd1ch0egongcchia2p3a531d@4ax.com...
> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Don Sample <dsample RemoveThis @synapse.net>
> wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:09:14 -0400 in alt.books.david-weber :
>>In article <iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v RemoveThis @4ax.com>,
>> pyotr filipivich <phamp RemoveThis @mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>>> <cheerfuliconoclast RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400
>>> in
>>> alt.books.david-weber :
>>> >On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>> >>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>> >>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>> >>
>>> >>wait and follow me
>>> >
>>> >I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>> >
>>> >Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>> >likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>> >this point.
>>>
>>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
>>> and highly probable.
>>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>>
>>OTOP, the Star Kingdom might be well situated to make a killing by
>>selling their second string weapons systems to all sides of the Solarian
>>civil war.
>
> True.
>
> But I have trouble with figuring out the "galactic"equivalent of "Cash &
> Carry".

Precious metals should still work. Food, tech, fabrics, a host of things
that might have some market value at another location.


> --
> pyotr filipivich
> The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
> better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.RemoveThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:ali8431384j1925s0rfk7qbgrdofqm0csp@4ax.com...
> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll.RemoveThis@bellsouth.net>
> wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:27:59 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>>
>>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.RemoveThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>>news:iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v@4ax.com...
>>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>>> <cheerfuliconoclast.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400
>>> in
>>> alt.books.david-weber :
>>>>On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>>>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>>>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>>>>
>>>>>wait and follow me
>>>>
>>>>I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>>>
>>>>Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>>>likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>>>this point.
>>>
>>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
>>> and highly probable.
>>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>>
>>Civil wars are blood baths.
>
> And there goes the economies of the various planets in the Solarian
> League, and along with that, any trade into or out of those areas. Some
> planets outside the league may not notice (grayson, Masada, the fringe
> areas of the Talbot cluster) but if there was any trade with Solarian
> Space, even indirectly, that is going to be "lost" For The Duration.

Not if you have the muscle to get your ships through. Manticore is a huge
trader inside the League.


> --
> pyotr filipivich
> The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
> better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

On Fri, 11 May 2007 16:12:34 -0400, Don Sample <dsample.DeleteThis@synapse.net>
wrote:

>Trade becomes riskier, which means that prices go up, which makes the
>potential profits to be made even higher. There may be regions of the
>former League where it becomes too risky to operate, but over-all I
>doubt if it will be any worse than operating in Silesia was, over the
>last few decades, and Silesia was a very profitable area for the Manties.

And if things get bad enough there is always the convoy option. Who
would take on any group of merchants escorted by even a pod cruiser.
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll DeleteThis @bellsouth.net>
wrote on Fri, 11 May 2007 20:10:24 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>
>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp DeleteThis @mindspring.com> wrote in message
>news:rii843d3bmdd1ch0egongcchia2p3a531d@4ax.com...
>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Don Sample <dsample DeleteThis @synapse.net>
>> wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:09:14 -0400 in alt.books.david-weber :
>>>In article <iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v DeleteThis @4ax.com>,
>>> pyotr filipivich <phamp DeleteThis @mindspring.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>>>> <cheerfuliconoclast DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400
>>>> in
>>>> alt.books.david-weber :
>>>> >On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>>> >>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>>> >>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>>> >>
>>>> >>wait and follow me
>>>> >
>>>> >I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>>> >
>>>> >Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>>> >likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>>> >this point.
>>>>
>>>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
>>>> and highly probable.
>>>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>>>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>>>
>>>OTOP, the Star Kingdom might be well situated to make a killing by
>>>selling their second string weapons systems to all sides of the Solarian
>>>civil war.
>>
>> True.
>>
>> But I have trouble with figuring out the "galactic"equivalent of "Cash &
>> Carry".
>
>Precious metals should still work. Food, tech, fabrics, a host of things
>that might have some market value at another location.

Which means you're in some kind of "barter" economy, which will work I
know. I recall, Frank Zappa brokering some deals whereby Russian timber
got shipped to Spain for processing into TP and then returned.

--
pyotr filipivich
The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll.DeleteThis@bellsouth.net>
wrote on Fri, 11 May 2007 20:12:01 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>
>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>news:ali8431384j1925s0rfk7qbgrdofqm0csp@4ax.com...
>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll.DeleteThis@bellsouth.net>
>> wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:27:59 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>>>
>>>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>>>news:iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v@4ax.com...
>>>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>>>> <cheerfuliconoclast.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007 10:01:03 -0400
>>>> in
>>>> alt.books.david-weber :
>>>>>On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>>>>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>>>>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>>>>>
>>>>>>wait and follow me
>>>>>
>>>>>I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>>>>
>>>>>Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>>>>likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>>>>this point.
>>>>
>>>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector, possible
>>>> and highly probable.
>>>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>>>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>>>
>>>Civil wars are blood baths.
>>
>> And there goes the economies of the various planets in the Solarian
>> League, and along with that, any trade into or out of those areas. Some
>> planets outside the league may not notice (grayson, Masada, the fringe
>> areas of the Talbot cluster) but if there was any trade with Solarian
>> Space, even indirectly, that is going to be "lost" For The Duration.
>
>Not if you have the muscle to get your ships through. Manticore is a huge
>trader inside the League.

I'm not talking about needing the muscle to get the convoy through, I'm
talking about the lack of someplace to get the convoy _to_ economically
speaking. E.g. In 1939 there was no need to escort merchants ships enroute
to post Civil War Spain. But there wasn't a whole lot of reason to go to
Spain anyway.
Why process materials if there is no buyers? (that you can see?) How
many of the Core planets grow all their food, (how many can?)?
Secondly is the issue of diversion of resources: to system defenses at
the minimum, to "active system defenses" (aka preemptive retaliatory
strikes.)

I am reminded, for some reason, of a bit of doggerel from the 1960s
(sung by missile crews to the bomber crews):

Press on through,
press on through.
The long and the brave and the True.
You're mission's been wasted
Your target Got pasted.
Our Missile got there before you!

Likewise with a convoy arriving at a planet which has just had the orbital
facilities knocked out.
--
pyotr filipivich
The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League? 

"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:38pb43d8s0orng8lk98nhg1lfsudafqb5j@4ax.com...
> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll.DeleteThis@bellsouth.net>
> wrote on Fri, 11 May 2007 20:12:01 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>>
>>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>>news:ali8431384j1925s0rfk7qbgrdofqm0csp@4ax.com...
>>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but "deowll" <deowll.DeleteThis@bellsouth.net>
>>> wrote on Thu, 10 May 2007 20:27:59 -0500 in alt.books.david-weber :
>>>>
>>>>"pyotr filipivich" <phamp.DeleteThis@mindspring.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:iv4743la8rbg84o0ls8kcjj8tm19b3om6v@4ax.com...
>>>>> Okay, so I'm late and catching up, but Cheerful Iconoclast
>>>>> <cheerfuliconoclast.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote on Wed, 09 May 2007
>>>>> 10:01:03 -0400
>>>>> in
>>>>> alt.books.david-weber :
>>>>>>On 7 May 2007 19:17:27 -0700, Lunan <knifelunatic.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I just can't get this thought out of my head with crown of slaves,
>>>>>>>shadow of saganami, and a little in at all costs it really feels to
>>>>>>>me like a war with the solarian league is coming
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>wait and follow me
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I'm sorry, but, well, duh.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Of course a larger-scale war involving the Solarian League (or more
>>>>>>likely its breakup) is in the cards. I mean, it's, well, obvious at
>>>>>>this point.
>>>>>
>>>>> Solarian Breakup - yes. Spill over into the Manticore sector,
>>>>> possible
>>>>> and highly probable.
>>>>> Economic Upheaval as a result of The Spacefareing Economy being
>>>>> fractured by civil war? What do you think?
>>>>
>>>>Civil wars are blood baths.
>>>
>>> And there goes the economies of the various planets in the Solarian
>>> League, and along with that, any trade into or out of those areas. Some
>>> planets outside the league may not notice (grayson, Masada, the fringe
>>> areas of the Talbot cluster) but if there was any trade with Solarian
>>> Space, even indirectly, that is going to be "lost" For The Duration.
>>
>>Not if you have the muscle to get your ships through. Manticore is a huge
>>trader inside the League.
>
> I'm not talking about needing the muscle to get the convoy through, I'm
> talking about the lack of someplace to get the convoy _to_ economically
> speaking. E.g. In 1939 there was no need to escort merchants ships
> enroute
> to post Civil War Spain. But there wasn't a whole lot of reason to go to
> Spain anyway.
> Why process materials if there is no buyers? (that you can see?) How
> many of the Core planets grow all their food, (how many can?)?
> Secondly is the issue of diversion of resources: to system defenses at
> the minimum, to "active system defenses" (aka preemptive retaliatory
> strikes.)
>
> I am reminded, for some reason, of a bit of doggerel from the 1960s
> (sung by missile crews to the bomber crews):
>
> Press on through,
> press on through.
> The long and the brave and the True.
> You're mission's been wasted
> Your target Got pasted.
> Our Missile got there before you!
>
> Likewise with a convoy arriving at a planet which has just had the orbital
> facilities knocked out.


Doesn't matter if you are hauling your own surface to ground unit.

> pyotr filipivich
> The two oldest cliches in the book are "The Good Old Days were
> better." and "After all, these are Modern TImes."
 >> Stay informed about: War with the Solarian League?