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What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- Joh..

 
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poguemidden

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Since: Jun 03, 2004
Posts: 1469



(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:41 pm
Post subject: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan
Archived from groups: alt>books>tom-clancy, others (more info?)

"Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"

"What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."

BY JOHN KEEGAN

Wednesday, August 16, 2006
The Wall Street Journal

"The mystery of the Iraq War is to explain how a brilliantly executed
invasion turned into a messy counterinsurgency struggle. Part of the
explanation, at least, is a lack of troops, a fault for which the Defense
Department has been responsible. The current policy has its roots in the
desire of Donald Rumsfeld, the defense secretary, to wean the Army away from
its decades of indulgence, when it routinely planned to win conflicts by
confronting enemies with mass--masses of soldiers, masses of equipment
(particularly tanks and armored vehicles) and masses of ground-attack
aircraft.

Mr. Rumsfeld disliked the concept of mass because it carried huge financial
costs but also because it locked the Army into a style of war-making that
sought victory through firepower rather than through speedy maneuver. He had
supporters in the civilian side of the Pentagon, notably his deputy, Paul
Wolfowitz, and a man the rank below, Douglas Feith. Both also wanted to slim
the Army down.

The result of their efforts to do so led to the expeditionary force sent to
Iraq in 2003 being considerably weaker than that which had fought the Gulf
War of 1991. The initial outcome, though, was similar: the rapid collapse of
Iraqi resistance at only slight cost in American lives, a result that seemed
to justify Mr. Rumsfeld's force policies and his belief that "speed kills."

For several months the second Iraq War seemed a triumph. Then the American
army of occupation, whose continuing presence was dedicated to the political
transformation of the country, began to come under low-grade attack by Iraqi
guerrillas. American soldiers began to die, and attempts to create a
successor regime, organized on democratic principles, failed to take root.
Political instability was accompanied by rising military difficulty, until
by 2005 a full-scale insurgency was in swing, with dozens of American
soldiers dying every month and the numbers of insurgents growing
proportionately.

In "Fiasco," Thomas Ricks traces this familiar history and attempts to
explain its reasons, interviewing various military experts and reporting
from the fighting in Iraq itself. He has severely critical views of Mr.
Rumsfeld, Mr. Wolfowitz and Mr. Feith, but he does not heap all the blame on
their preinvasion policy. He also points to the mistakes made by American
leaders of the postwar administration in Iraq, notably Paul Bremer, who
became head of the Coalition Provisional Authority in May 2003.

Mr. Bremer's prime mistakes, according to Mr. Ricks, were to disband the
Iraqi army and to bar former members of the Baath party from positions in
government. Disbanding the army released tens of thousands of trained
fighters into unemployment; barring Baathists from administrative positions
robbed the new governing coalition of the service of the very people it
needed to restore order and good government. These mistakes, Mr. Ricks
thinks, ensured that the initial failure of the occupation would persist and
worsen.

Few would disagree with the analysis in "Fiasco." It is not, however, a
complete explanation of what went wrong. Mr. Ricks makes several convincing
points about what underlay the insurgency, notably the supreme importance of
the value of respect for personal dignity in Arab society. He notes how, at
least in the early stages of the occupation, American forces too often
showed unconcern for Iraqi dignity--by performing too many tasks and
conducting too many operations unilaterally. But he does not take account of
what may underlie the whole insurgency, which is the rise of Islamic
militancy across the Muslim world.

America was so certain that what it had to offer--modern government in an
incorrupt and democratic form--was so obviously desirable that it failed
altogether to understand that the Iraqis wanted something else, which is
self-government in an Islamic form. It is too late now to start again.

All that can be hoped is that the U.S. Army will prevail in its
counterinsurgency and, as Mr. Ricks's gripping accounts of the troops in
action suggest, it may still. His description of Marines "attacking into an
ambush" leaves one in no doubt that American soldiers know combat secrets
that their enemies do not and cannot match. Whether pure military skills
will win the war, however, cannot be predicted."

"Mr. Keegan is the author of "The Face of Battle," "The Iraq War" and many
other books.
----------------------------------------

DSH

Lux et Veritas et Libertas

Deus Vult

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David Raleigh Arnold

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Since: Jul 20, 2006
Posts: 4



(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 12:33 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:

> "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
>
> "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."

Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong country.
Should have invaded Saudi Arabia, which is the source of the terrorism.
They've been paying off the Ayatollahs since the Shah stopped doing it.
They control Bin Laden. Do you really think that Bin Laden does anything
Saud doesn't want done, when he can hold his 19 brothers and sisters
hostage? When he can cut their balls, tits, and heads off? Are these
'leaders' idiots? Are they children? How can 'experts' like Mr.
Keegan be so stupid and naive? What do they think they're playing at?
It's just incredible. daveA

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Mark Test

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Since: Nov 15, 2004
Posts: 112



(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 9:37 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4.RemoveThis@cox.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
> On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
>
> > "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
> >
> > "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
>
> Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong country.

You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....

IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.

Mark
--
"I believe that Islamic terrorists will stop at nothing in their mad quest
to rule the globe. As a result, World War III has started, whether we like
it or not. It will continue, whether we fight back or not. But if we think
we can win by not fighting, then we're not just wrong. We're nuts."

--Michael Goodwin



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fmccall

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Since: Mar 03, 2004
Posts: 2393



(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:18 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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David Raleigh Arnold <darnold4 RemoveThis @cox.net> wrote:

:On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
:
:> "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
:>
:> "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
:
:Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong country.
:Should have invaded Saudi Arabia, which is the source of the terrorism.
:They've been paying off the Ayatollahs since the Shah stopped doing it.
:They control Bin Laden. Do you really think that Bin Laden does anything
:Saud doesn't want done,

Yes, which is why he is under sentence of death should he ever be
found inside the borders of Saudi Arabia. One of the things Osama bin
Laden espouses is the overthrow of the House of Saud and its
replacement by a religious government.

Can you really be THIS ignorant and yet think you know enough to even
have an opinion?

:when he can hold his 19 brothers and sisters
:hostage? When he can cut their balls, tits, and heads off? Are these
:'leaders' idiots? Are they children?

No, but you quite obviously are.

--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn
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poguemidden

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Since: Jun 03, 2004
Posts: 1469



(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 5:42 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Bingo!

DSH

"Mark Test" <MARKT38.RemoveThis@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:44ed207f$0$8850$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...

> "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4.RemoveThis@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...

>> On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
>>
>> > "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
>> >
>> > "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
>>
>> Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong country.
>
> You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
> groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
>
> IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
> the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
>
> Mark
> --
> "I believe that Islamic terrorists will stop at nothing in their mad quest
> to rule the globe. As a result, World War III has started, whether we like
> it or not. It will continue, whether we fight back or not. But if we think
> we can win by not fighting, then we're not just wrong. We're nuts."
>
> --Michael Goodwin
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remsen591

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Since: May 24, 2004
Posts: 47



(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:29 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Mark Test wrote:
> "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4 DeleteThis @cox.net> wrote in message
> news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
>
>>On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
>>>
>>>"What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
>>
>>Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong country.
>
>
> You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
> groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
>
> IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
> the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
>
> Mark

Are you over there right now? I'm betting not as if we happen to attack
Iran, a bunch of those "quiet provinces" in Iraq might get loud real
quick. I'm sure all our troops will appreciate your bravado. And you are
right that diplomacy will likely fail, but it's because people like
yourself voted in a neophyte with very little capacity to learn on the
job. Good work tough guy.
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a.spencer3

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Since: Feb 11, 2005
Posts: 415



(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:17 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"D. Spencer Hines" <poguemidden.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:m7aHg.226$15.2499@eagle.america.net...
> Bingo!
>
> DSH
>
> "Mark Test" <MARKT38.TakeThisOut@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
> news:44ed207f$0$8850$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
>
> > "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4.TakeThisOut@cox.net> wrote in message
> > news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
>
> >> On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
> >>
> >> > "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
> >> >
> >> > "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
> >>
> >> Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong
country.
> >
> > You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
> > groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> > Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> > country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
> >
> > IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
> > the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
> >
> > Mark
> > --
> > "I believe that Islamic terrorists will stop at nothing in their mad
quest
> > to rule the globe. As a result, World War III has started, whether we
like
> > it or not. It will continue, whether we fight back or not. But if we
think
> > we can win by not fighting, then we're not just wrong. We're nuts."
> >

Conventional fighting (especially against the wrong people) didn't stop the
plot to down numerous aircraft recently.

Think again.

Twit.

Surreyman
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Mark Test

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Since: Nov 15, 2004
Posts: 112



(Msg. 8) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:52 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Drew Remsen" <remsen59.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:eck9cr$m1g$1@news1.usf.edu...
> Mark Test wrote:
> > "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4.TakeThisOut@cox.net> wrote in message
> > news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
> >
> >>On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>"Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
> >>>
> >>>"What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
> >>
> >>Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong country.
> >
> >
> > You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
> > groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> > Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> > country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
> >
> > IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
> > the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
> >
> > Mark
>
> Are you over there right now? I'm betting not as if we happen to attack
> Iran, a bunch of those "quiet provinces" in Iraq might get loud real
> quick. I'm sure all our troops will appreciate your bravado. And you are
> right that diplomacy will likely fail, but it's because people like
> yourself voted in a neophyte with very little capacity to learn on the
> job. Good work tough guy.

I'm sure diplomacy will fail since Iran has never once done what they
said they would do. However, they continue to assert that they want
Israel destroyed and nukes would help them in that matter.

When did the world decide to talk to facists? We fought a world war
with facists, now a facist movement is growing in strength and in power,
and everyone refuses to stop them. Now I know what it must've been
like in 1936 when the Nazi's were on the march.....

History does repeat itself.....

Mark



--
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Mark Test

External


Since: Nov 15, 2004
Posts: 112



(Msg. 9) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:56 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"a.spencer3" <a.spencer3 RemoveThis @ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:HikHg.3192$s4.3093@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
>
> "D. Spencer Hines" <poguemidden RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:m7aHg.226$15.2499@eagle.america.net...
> > Bingo!
> >
> > DSH
> >
> > "Mark Test" <MARKT38 RemoveThis @peoplepc.com> wrote in message
> > news:44ed207f$0$8850$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
> >
> > > "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4 RemoveThis @cox.net> wrote in message
> > > news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
> >
> > >> On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
> > >> >
> > >> > "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
> > >>
> > >> Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong
> country.
> > >
> > > You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
> > > groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> > > Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> > > country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
> > >
> > > IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
> > > the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
> > >
> > > Mark
> > > --
> > > "I believe that Islamic terrorists will stop at nothing in their mad
> quest
> > > to rule the globe. As a result, World War III has started, whether we
> like
> > > it or not. It will continue, whether we fight back or not. But if we
> think
> > > we can win by not fighting, then we're not just wrong. We're nuts."
> > >
>
> Conventional fighting (especially against the wrong people) didn't stop
the
> plot to down numerous aircraft recently.
>
So Iran doesn't support terrorists? Iran doesn't supply Hezbo? Why are
they the wrong country to hit in this war on terror?

BTW, Pakistan, Jordan, Saudi, all actively pursue and do not fund
terrorists, Iran and Syria continue to support them.

> Think again.
>
No need to.

> Twit.

Idiot.


Mark



--
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a.spencer3

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Since: Feb 11, 2005
Posts: 415



(Msg. 10) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 6:07 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>books>tom-clancy, others (more info?)

<Akorps.DeleteThis@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1156438007.831510.295270@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
>
> One thing we did was underestimate the cleverness and cunning of the
> enemy. We don't understand their culture (or literature) very well.
>
> Israel is going through recriminations about the campaign in Lebanon,
> but the main problem was the new tactics and strategy used by
> Hellzbullah, as such new methods often are very difficult to deal with
> at first.
>

It's called guerilla warfare.
It's been around a long time.

Surreyman
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Peter Skelton

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Since: Apr 19, 2004
Posts: 236



(Msg. 11) Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:14 pm
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>books>tom-clancy, others (more info?)

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:56:37 -0700, "Mark Test"
<MARKT38 RemoveThis @peoplepc.com> wrote:

>"a.spencer3" <a.spencer3 RemoveThis @ntlworld.com> wrote in message
>news:HikHg.3192$s4.3093@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
>>
>> "D. Spencer Hines" <poguemidden RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:m7aHg.226$15.2499@eagle.america.net...
>> > Bingo!
>> >
>> > DSH
>> >
>> > "Mark Test" <MARKT38 RemoveThis @peoplepc.com> wrote in message
>> > news:44ed207f$0$8850$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
>> >
>> > > "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4 RemoveThis @cox.net> wrote in message
>> > > news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
>> >
>> > >> On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> > "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
>> > >> >
>> > >> > "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
>> > >>
>> > >> Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong
>> country.
>> > >
>> > > You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
>> > > groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
>> > > Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
>> > > country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
>> > >
>> > > IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
>> > > the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
>> > >
>> > > Mark
>> > > --
>> > > "I believe that Islamic terrorists will stop at nothing in their mad
>> quest
>> > > to rule the globe. As a result, World War III has started, whether we
>> like
>> > > it or not. It will continue, whether we fight back or not. But if we
>> think
>> > > we can win by not fighting, then we're not just wrong. We're nuts."
>> > >
>>
>> Conventional fighting (especially against the wrong people) didn't stop
>the
>> plot to down numerous aircraft recently.
>>
>So Iran doesn't support terrorists? Iran doesn't supply Hezbo? Why are
>they the wrong country to hit in this war on terror?
>
>BTW, Pakistan, Jordan, Saudi, all actively pursue and do not fund
>terrorists, Iran and Syria continue to support them.
>
Mark, most Arabic language terrorist material in this country is
printed in Saudi Arabia, paid for by Saudis and shipped by them.
It is probably the same where you live. Drop by any Mosque, ask
the Iman to show you.

That doesn't mean the government is involved, it does mean the
right families don't get investigated.

Peter Skelton
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Eric Hartup

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Since: Aug 25, 2006
Posts: 1



(Msg. 12) Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:51 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Mark Test" <MARKT38.DeleteThis@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:44ee2ea0$0$8872$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
> "Drew Remsen" <remsen59.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:eck9cr$m1g$1@news1.usf.edu...
>
> I'm sure diplomacy will fail since Iran has never once done what they
> said they would do. However, they continue to assert that they want
> Israel destroyed and nukes would help them in that matter.
>
> When did the world decide to talk to facists? We fought a world war
> with facists, now a facist movement is growing in strength and in power,
> and everyone refuses to stop them. Now I know what it must've been
> like in 1936 when the Nazi's were on the march.....
>
> History does repeat itself.....
>
> Mark
>
The whole root of the problem is America's continual support of Israel. We
never see any references to the fact that Isreal has nuclear weapons and the
fact that they have usurped land belonging to the Palestinians. Until this
land is handed back to the Palestinians there will be 'freedom fighters'
operating by any method available to them. Remember, Ben Gurion was a
'freedom fighter' and was responsible for the first major terrorist act by
bombing the King David Hotel.
One man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.
America should get rid of the Zionist domination in their politics and
England should get rid of the leader with the brown ring round his nose!
Eric H
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fmccall

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Since: Mar 03, 2004
Posts: 2393



(Msg. 13) Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 6:27 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Eric Hartup" <ehartup RemoveThis @blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

:One man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.

Only fans of terrorists believe this stupidity.

--
"It's always different. It's always complex. But at some point,
somebody has to draw the line. And that somebody is always me....
I am the law."
-- Buffy, The Vampire Slayer
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a.spencer3

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Since: Feb 11, 2005
Posts: 415



(Msg. 14) Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:20 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Mark Test" <MARKT38.DeleteThis@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:44ee2ea0$0$8872$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
> "Drew Remsen" <remsen59.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:eck9cr$m1g$1@news1.usf.edu...
> > Mark Test wrote:
> > > "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4.DeleteThis@cox.net> wrote in message
> > > news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
> > >
> > >>On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>"Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
> > >>>
> > >>>"What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
> > >>
> > >>Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong
country.
> > >
> > >
> > > You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter of
> > > groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> > > Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> > > country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
> > >
> > > IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get outta
> > > the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
> > >
> > > Mark
> >
> > Are you over there right now? I'm betting not as if we happen to attack
> > Iran, a bunch of those "quiet provinces" in Iraq might get loud real
> > quick. I'm sure all our troops will appreciate your bravado. And you are
> > right that diplomacy will likely fail, but it's because people like
> > yourself voted in a neophyte with very little capacity to learn on the
> > job. Good work tough guy.
>
> I'm sure diplomacy will fail since Iran has never once done what they
> said they would do. However, they continue to assert that they want
> Israel destroyed and nukes would help them in that matter.
>
> When did the world decide to talk to facists? We fought a world war
> with facists, now a facist movement is growing in strength and in power,
> and everyone refuses to stop them. Now I know what it must've been
> like in 1936 when the Nazi's were on the march.....
>
> History does repeat itself.....
>
What is Fascism?
There is no political relationship whatsoever between previous Fascist
governments and these crazed groups.
Bush decided to call the Islamic terrorist 'fascists' purely for propaganda
purposes.
It's worked on you.

Surreyman
 >> Stay informed about: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- Joh.. 
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a.spencer3

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Since: Feb 11, 2005
Posts: 415



(Msg. 15) Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:23 am
Post subject: Re: What Went Wrong In Iraq -- And How To Make It Right -- John Keegan [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Mark Test" <MARKT38.TakeThisOut@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:44ee2f94$0$8848$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
> "a.spencer3" <a.spencer3.TakeThisOut@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:HikHg.3192$s4.3093@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
> >
> > "D. Spencer Hines" <poguemidden.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:m7aHg.226$15.2499@eagle.america.net...
> > > Bingo!
> > >
> > > DSH
> > >
> > > "Mark Test" <MARKT38.TakeThisOut@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
> > > news:44ed207f$0$8850$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...
> > >
> > > > "David Raleigh Arnold" <darnold4.TakeThisOut@cox.net> wrote in message
> > > > news:pan.2006.08.23.16.33.53.609123@cox.net...
> > >
> > > >> On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:41:35 +0100, D. Spencer Hines wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > "Why Victory Still Proves Elusive"
> > > >> >
> > > >> > "What went wrong in Iraq -- and how to make it right."
> > > >>
> > > >> Nothing can be done to make it right. The US invaded the wrong
> > country.
> > > >
> > > > You're an idiot. What country is the world's number one supporter
of
> > > > groups like Hezzbollah? This same country is located right between
> > > > Iraq and Afghanistan.....We are in place to put such a hurt on said
> > > > country....IF diplomacy fails, and it will....
> > > >
> > > > IF you are afraid to combat evil....just say so....and then get
outta
> > > > the way of us who aren't afraid to stop evil.
> > > >
> > > > Mark
> > > > --
> > > > "I believe that Islamic terrorists will stop at nothing in their mad
> > quest
> > > > to rule the globe. As a result, World War III has started, whether
we
> > like
> > > > it or not. It will continue, whether we fight back or not. But if we
> > think
> > > > we can win by not fighting, then we're not just wrong. We're nuts."
> > > >
> >
> > Conventional fighting (especially against the wrong people) didn't stop
> the
> > plot to down numerous aircraft recently.
> >
> So Iran doesn't support terrorists? Iran doesn't supply Hezbo? Why are
> they the wrong country to hit in this war on terror?
>
> BTW, Pakistan, Jordan, Saudi, all actively pursue and do not fund
> terrorists, Iran and Syria continue to support them.
>
> > Think again.
> >
> No need to.
>
> > Twit.
>
> Idiot.
>
>
We're not fighting Iran or Syria yet.

Twit.

Surreyman
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