Thrint Question

"Gene Ward Smith" <gene.TakeThisOut@chewbacca.org> wrote in message
news:Xns9A1F8C8437A77genewardsmithsbcglob@207.115.33.102...
> Aidan Karley <name1_name2.TakeThisOut@email.provider.invalid> wrote in
> news:VA.000014d0.13913e35@email.provider.invalid:
>
>> In article <Xns9A1EB9B8DAAA3genewardsmithsbcglob.TakeThisOut@207.115.33.102>, Gene
>> Ward Smith wrote:
>>> None of this leads to a Gaussian distribution.
>>>
>> *A priori* , no.
>> But the *practice* of the IQ scale is a Gaussian of mean 100 and
>> S.D. 15 .
>
> Approximately, but the approximation isn't that great.
>
>
ISTR 145 (standford binet) being closer to 4 sigmas than 3
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

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> Dahak
> View profile
> More options Jan 6, 8:43 am
> Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written

Dahak <Dahak... RemoveThis @theXOUTfifthimperium.com.invalid> wrote on Sun, 06 Jan
2008 11:43:39 -0500
> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 11:11:47 -0500, an orbiting mind-control laser
> made Sea Wasp <seawaspObvi... RemoveThis @sgeObviousinc.com> write:
>
> > The Thrintun were powerful.
>
> > They were also only slightly brighter than the average ape. In other
> >words, dumb as posts. With the Power, they didn't HAVE to be very bright.
>
> I agree with all the comments made, but my take has always been
> that the Rocket Scientist (TM) who used the Galactic Amplifier Helmet
> ordered all /slaves/ (non-Thrint) to kill themselves and then Thrintun
> civilization collapsed in short order from the immediate, total loss
> of the slave infrastructure.
>
> Of course, Greenberg's speculation was "Then they ordered
> everything within reach to commit suicide." The Thrintun may not have
> been spared from the Command - a classic example of Thrintun thought
> processes.

Thank you. I've been trying to remember where I read that the Thrintun
committed suicide along with their slaves!
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

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James Gassaway wrote on Jan 6, 8:50 am:

> Tim Bruening wrote:
> > Paul Colquhoun wrote:
>
> >> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 03:29:13 -0800, Tim Bruening
> >> <tsbru....DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a super
> >>> duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the galaxy
> >>> to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the Thrint
> >>> apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All Tnuctipun
> >>> commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one day nap").
>
> >> It's fairly well established that the Thrint weren't very bright...
>
> > But surly they would be used to giving specific orders to specific
> > slaves.
>
> That's what trustees and overseers are for.

Wouldn't trustees and overseers have dominated the Elders who built the
Super Duper Amplifier Helmet (TM) and thus have given the suicide order
ONLY to the Tnuctipun?
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

Dahak <Dahak....DeleteThis@theXOUTfifthimperium.com.invalid> wrote on Sun, 06 Jan
2008 11:43:39 -0500
> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 11:11:47 -0500, an orbiting mind-control laser
> made Sea Wasp <seawaspObvi....DeleteThis@sgeObviousinc.com> write:
>
> > The Thrintun were powerful.
>
> > They were also only slightly brighter than the average ape. In other
> >words, dumb as posts. With the Power, they didn't HAVE to be very bright.
>
> I agree with all the comments made, but my take has always been
> that the Rocket Scientist (TM) who used the Galactic Amplifier Helmet
> ordered all /slaves/ (non-Thrint) to kill themselves and then Thrintun
> civilization collapsed in short order from the immediate, total loss
> of the slave infrastructure.
>
> Of course, Greenberg's speculation was "Then they ordered
> everything within reach to commit suicide." The Thrintun may not have
> been spared from the Command - a classic example of Thrintun thought
> processes.

Thank you. I've been trying to remember where I read that the Thrintun
committed suicide along with their slaves!
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

James Gassaway wrote on Jan 6, 8:50 am:

> Tim Bruening wrote:
> > Paul Colquhoun wrote:
>
> >> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 03:29:13 -0800, Tim Bruening
> >> <tsbru....DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a super
> >>> duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the galaxy
> >>> to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the Thrint
> >>> apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All Tnuctipun
> >>> commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one day nap").
>
> >> It's fairly well established that the Thrint weren't very bright...
>
> > But surly they would be used to giving specific orders to specific
> > slaves.
>
> That's what trustees and overseers are for.

Wouldn't trustees and overseers have dominated the Elders who built the
Super Duper Amplifier Helmet (TM) and thus have given the suicide order
ONLY to the Tnuctipun?
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

"James Gassaway" <dtravel.DeleteThis@sonic.net> wrote in news:47843834$0$36361
$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net:

>> Humans are related to apes, but aren't apes.
>
> We're prime-apes.
>

Except for bishops, of course, who are genuine.
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

Tim Bruening wrote:
> James Gassaway wrote:
>
>> Tim Bruening wrote:
>>> Sea Wasp wrote:
>>>
>>>> Tim Bruening wrote:
>>>>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a
>>>>> super duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the
>>>>> galaxy to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the
>>>>> Thrint apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All
>>>>> Tnuctipun commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one
>>>>> day nap").
>>>>
>>>> The Thrintun were powerful.
>>>>
>>>> They were also only slightly brighter than the average ape.
>>>> In other words, dumb as posts. With the Power, they didn't HAVE to
>>>> be very bright.
>>>
>>> I defy any average (non-human) ape to operate a space ship!
>>
>> Define "operate".
>>
>> (I'm remembering various early orbital missions testing whether or
>> not humans could survive by sending chimps up and having them
>> perform tasks of varying degrees of complexity.)
>
> I'm thinking in terms of the ape being able to cause the spaceship to
> take off, fly to its destination, and land. I also want the ape to
> be able to choose the spaceship's destination and set its course.
>
> What tasks did the space chimps perform?

I don't remember but someone posted a link to information on them before I
posted.

--
"Reading by the light of a lost Christmas day
It begins...."
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

Tim Bruening wrote:
>
> James Gassaway wrote on Jan 6, 8:50 am:
>
>> Tim Bruening wrote:
>>> Paul Colquhoun wrote:
>>
>>>> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 03:29:13 -0800, Tim Bruening
>>>> <tsbru... RemoveThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
>>>>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a
>>>>> super duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the
>>>>> galaxy to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the
>>>>> Thrint apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All
>>>>> Tnuctipun commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one
>>>>> day nap").
>>
>>>> It's fairly well established that the Thrint weren't very bright...
>>
>>> But surly they would be used to giving specific orders to specific
>>> slaves.
>>
>> That's what trustees and overseers are for.
>
> Wouldn't trustees and overseers have dominated the Elders who built
> the Super Duper Amplifier Helmet (TM) and thus have given the suicide
> order ONLY to the Tnuctipun?

I'm not sure I understand your question, but trustees and overseers are
themselves slaves. In the Tnuctipun slave uprising, they (trustees and
overseers) were probably the ones leading it. Since the Thrint were not
bright, were used to working thru the trustees and overseers and probably in
a bit of a panic, it seems entirely reasonable that they could have simply
given a all-encompassing general "DIE!" order before thinking it thru at
all.

--
"Reading by the light of a lost Christmas day
It begins...."
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

James Gassaway wrote:

> Tim Bruening wrote:
> >
> > James Gassaway wrote on Jan 6, 8:50 am:
> >
> >> Tim Bruening wrote:
> >>> Paul Colquhoun wrote:
> >>
> >>>> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 03:29:13 -0800, Tim Bruening
> >>>> <tsbru... DeleteThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >>>>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a
> >>>>> super duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the
> >>>>> galaxy to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the
> >>>>> Thrint apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All
> >>>>> Tnuctipun commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one
> >>>>> day nap").
> >>
> >>>> It's fairly well established that the Thrint weren't very bright...
> >>
> >>> But surly they would be used to giving specific orders to specific
> >>> slaves.
> >>
> >> That's what trustees and overseers are for.
> >
> > Wouldn't trustees and overseers have dominated the Elders who built
> > the Super Duper Amplifier Helmet (TM) and thus have given the suicide
> > order ONLY to the Tnuctipun?
>
> I'm not sure I understand your question, but trustees and overseers are
> themselves slaves. In the Tnuctipun slave uprising, they (trustees and
> overseers) were probably the ones leading it. Since the Thrint were not
> bright, were used to working thru the trustees and overseers and probably in
> a bit of a panic, it seems entirely reasonable that they could have simply
> given a all-encompassing general "DIE!" order before thinking it thru at
> all.

I understand that it took the Thrint Elders a while to build the super
amplifier, giving them time to think of giving the suicide order ONLY to the
Tnuctipun, or think of simply ordering all slaves to "Forget any thought of
rebellion!".
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

James Gassaway wrote:

> Tim Bruening wrote:
> >
> > James Gassaway wrote on Jan 6, 8:50 am:
> >
> >> Tim Bruening wrote:
> >>> Paul Colquhoun wrote:
> >>
> >>>> On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 03:29:13 -0800, Tim Bruening
> >>>> <tsbru....DeleteThis@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> >>>>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a
> >>>>> super duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the
> >>>>> galaxy to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the
> >>>>> Thrint apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All
> >>>>> Tnuctipun commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one
> >>>>> day nap").
> >>
> >>>> It's fairly well established that the Thrint weren't very bright...
> >>
> >>> But surly they would be used to giving specific orders to specific
> >>> slaves.
> >>
> >> That's what trustees and overseers are for.
> >
> > Wouldn't trustees and overseers have dominated the Elders who built
> > the Super Duper Amplifier Helmet (TM) and thus have given the suicide
> > order ONLY to the Tnuctipun?
>
> I'm not sure I understand your question, but trustees and overseers are
> themselves slaves. In the Tnuctipun slave uprising, they (trustees and
> overseers) were probably the ones leading it. Since the Thrint were not
> bright, were used to working thru the trustees and overseers and probably in
> a bit of a panic, it seems entirely reasonable that they could have simply
> given a all-encompassing general "DIE!" order before thinking it thru at
> all.

I thought you were typing about Thrint trustees and overseers who were tasked
with giving specific orders to specific slaves.
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

James Gassaway wrote:

> Tim Bruening wrote:
> > Sea Wasp wrote:
> >
> >> Tim Bruening wrote:
> >>> To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a super
> >>> duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the galaxy
> >>> to commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the Thrint
> >>> apply the suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All Tnuctipun
> >>> commit suicide at once. All other slaves take a one day nap").
> >>
> >> The Thrintun were powerful.
> >>
> >> They were also only slightly brighter than the average ape.
> >> In other words, dumb as posts. With the Power, they didn't HAVE to
> >> be very bright.
> >
> > I defy any average (non-human) ape to operate a space ship!
>
> Define "operate".
>
> (I'm remembering various early orbital missions testing whether or not
> humans could survive by sending chimps up and having them perform tasks of
> varying degrees of complexity.)

I'm thinking in terms of the ape being able to cause the spaceship to
take
off, fly to its destination, and land. I also want the ape to be able
to
choose the spaceship's destination and set its course.
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

norrin wrote:

> On Jan 6, 3:29 am, Tim Bruening <tsbru... RemoveThis @pop.dcn.davis.ca.us> wrote:
> > To put down the Tnuctipun uprising, the Thrint elders built a super
> > duper amplifier helmet and used it to order everyone in the galaxy to
> > commit suicide, including themselves. Why didn't the Thrint apply the
> > suicide order only to the Tnuctipun? ("All Tnuctipun commit suicide at
> > once. All other slaves take a one day nap").
>
> The Tnuctipun are vital to the Thrint economy. If they die,
> the Thrint will waste away. For a long time, the Thrint had
> no enemies and they lost the knack for self preservation.

I have come up with a much better command for the Thrint to give: "Forget all
thoughts of rebellion!".
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question 

Erik Max Francis wrote on Jan 8, 1:56 pm:




> Tim Bruening wrote:
>
>
> > Erik Max Francis wrote:
>
> >> Tim Bruening wrote:
>
> >>> I got the impression in "World of P'Tavvs" that even the Thrintun were ordered to commit
> >>> suicide!
> >> Then you read really poorly.
>
> > I remember two versions: One in which the Thrint committed suicide also, and another in which
> > they survived Suicide Night but couldn't live without their slaves.
>
> And where do you "remember" the first version from?
>

PP 137-138: Kzanol/Greenberg speculates that to keep the Tnuctipun from
winning, the Thrintun built a Big Amplifier and used it to order everything in
the galaxy to commit suicide. I took "everything" to include the Thrintun!
 >> Stay informed about: Thrint Question