"Kristian Damm Jensen" <REdammMOVE.DeleteThis@ofir.dk> wrote in message news:<c62nnu$637b9$1@ID-146708.news.uni-berlin.de>...
> Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
> > Steuard Jensen <sbjensen.DeleteThis@midway.uchicago.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> I would love to see something like that. Trouble is, I'm probably
> >> one of the only people I'd trust to write it (I was as close to
> >> neutral as active posters came during the flame wars
> >
> > Maybe just a brief history lesson on the flame wars?
> > Or even just _when_ they took place?
>
> If memory serves me (it was one of the few periods in the history of the
> newsgroup when I was out of touch) the first one started in the autumn of
> 1996 and continued for several month. The primary issue was (at the
> beginning) whether or not balrogs had wing, if they could fly, if the
> balrogs of the Silmarillion where in essense the same creatures of LoTR
> etc. (And of course the colour of their furry slippers.)
If the question is about "the first Michael Martinez" flame war, the
official first one started in early 1996 and concerned Tolkien's
identification of Middle-earth with the round world. The flaming
started when I couldn't think of a polite way to point out that people
who felt Middle-earth was only Europe were being Eurocentric (I may
have said snobbish or something like that).
The next flame war came about later that year when David Salo went off
the deep end for the first (and not the last time).
The four-year spate of MM flame wars (which has continued in a mostly
one-sided fashion from regulars in this news group for the past three
years) began in the autumn of 1997 when someone calling himself
something Giles falsely accused me -- repeatedly -- of frequently
claiming to have "the only valid interpretation", and the cry was
taken up by one idiot after another until someone tried to calm things
down on a day when I had a high, delusionary fever (I sent a
long-winded attempt to debunk Einstein's theory of relatively to a
scientist in Europe -- his reply was, "I don't understand this", and
when I read his reply after the fever had broken, I didn't understand
it either). Anyway, tangents aside, under the influence of that
fever, I went ballistic, and some of the less intelligent people in
the group stepped in to increase the flammage of the wars, and they
kept it going for several years.
> The antagonism developed during these "discusssions" was so great that
> several of the participants afterwards were unable to engage in any kind of
> discussion with the other part without this too developing into a new
> flamewar.
Oh, it didn't become THAT bad so quickly. The problem was that
several people (some of whom still post anti-MM comments on a regular
basis) insisted on attacking me for no reason whatsoever, and I
responded, which only fed the fury of the other inflammatory posters
who felt they were justified in their ridiculous attacks because
"numbers tell", or some stupid logic like that.
> This
> sad state remained for some time, until Michael Martinez (the major player
> on one side of the flamewars) decided to devote his time in stead to his
> web site.
No, I had always been devoting time to the Web site. I pulled out of
the flame groups because I had too many other things to do (most
online discussion groups proved to be more mature and interesting than
these groups).
> Michael Martinez still pops into this newsgroup occasionally, but since
> some people are still quite sore and willing to take offense at the
> slightest opportunity, this invariably develops into a new flamewar until
> MM decides to withdraw one again.
Technically, as I pointed out above, the flaming never stops. Bad
history lessons like yours only make the problem worse.
It would be best if people stopped trying to explain the past. None
of you ever get the facts right and you just perpetuate the myth of
the Martinez monster.
>> Stay informed about: Tolkien newsgroups history 
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In other words,